Growing up in the church I learned quickly that the Bible was the word of God and that God spoke to us through his word. Everything had go along with the Bible or it was not of God.
I often wondered how a book written by many different people over many years, and in a time period so different from our own could be inerrant and the only way God communicated.
My personal belief is that the written word of God, which we call the Bible is God-breathed and useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, as mentioned in 2 Timothy 3:16.
Yet while reading some of the sermon on the mount in Matthew 5:21 to 44, we listen to Jesus as he speaks to the crowds. Many times he says “you have heard it said” then mentions a verse from the written word. Each time he follows this with “but I say unto you” and follows with his words of advice. To me this says that Jesus, who is the living, inerrant Word of God has final authority over any written word which we call the bible. And remember Jesus spoke these words before the New Testament of our Bible was even written.
We read in John 1:1, in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.
Again in John 1:14 we read ‘The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only Son, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth’. The written words of the Bible did not become flesh and dwell among us, only Jesus fulfilled that verse.
And in Revelation 19:13 He is clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.
For me, I believe the Bible is inspired by God, written by men and useful for leading us to the living, inerrant Word of God who is Jesus.
I am certainly not saying we should not read the Bible, but we should not elevate the Bible to a position of authority which matches that of Jesus. We are not to worship the Bible, nor are we to disregard the leading and teaching of the Holy Spirit who lives within us. He will guide us into all truth.
Well spoken
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Thank you.
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I think oldschoolcontemporary brings up some great points. In my opinion,both the Scriptures and Jesus can rightfully be called the Word of God. While we do not have the original documents,I believe we can trust the Scriptures and errors are due to translations,not inspiration and the Holy Spirit definitely helps us spot that.The cohesiveness of the Scriptures written by over 40 men from different time periods over 1400 years,with no possibility of collaborating,is one of the greatest evidences of divine inspiration. In this post you mentioned several scriptures where the word of God is obviously a reference to Jesus,yet there are also many scriptures that speak of the word of God,that are referring to the written word,not specifically Jesus. The very scriptures you use to make the point of Jesus being the Word of God are, are from the written Word and you have given them authority. If we can’t trust the scriptures or give them authority because they are only written words by men and not the Living Word,then the very scriptures you spoke of can not be trusted either. Part of the problem within Christianity is there are many who do not understand their is division in the word.Those who were under the Mosaic law for example,were to live and do things that would be foolish for christians today to practice….yet many do so not understanding they are not under law but under grace.They think they’re living by the word of God,but in reality they are contradicting it. I also think Jesus has all authority and the Holy Spirit can lead us into all truth…but that thought didn’t just pop out of my own brain…I read it from a Bible.While certainly the H oly spirit does not need the Bible to lead us,I feel we are fortunate to have the Scriptures to look to for discernment at those times when we are not sure.Just as people can mistakenly think they are living by the Word,they can also mistakenly think they are being led by the Spirit.
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I agree Daryl. My point is that the written word is not part of the trinity and not the only way God speaks. As you mentioned, there is a lot of misunderstanding and wrong interpretation in the original meaning of many verses yet the written word, with guidance of the Spirit is very useful in teaching about our Father and in leading us to the living Word who is Jesus. So many times people treat the written word as equal to God when it is about God and leads us to Him. Thanks for commenting.
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This is an interesting article that sheds light on thinking more of the text than the text says about itself. Although, I have one question, how would you reply to a person who said they have their own testimony from holy spirit, and they say that God’s spirit has shown them that Jesus isn’t the Word of God, he is instead a powerful spirit creature, the first creation of Jehovah God. He is a mighty god, but not God Himself. They tell you holy spirit, which isn’t a person, but an impersonal force (God’s energy), has shown them the truth about how Jesus is and who the word was in the past, for “the word was with god, and the word was [a] god”, they were none other than Michael, the archangel, the first and only creation of Jehovah. They tell you how Jesus has not come in the flesh, but in the spirit, since no flesh can inherit the kingdom of heaven.
Would you share Jesus, the Son and eternal Word, resurrected in power, glory and bodily, with this person, and if you would, could you please explain how you might go about doing so. I understand you do not like to debate your views, or perhaps even to converse about them for a long period of time, for which, I promise in the comments not to rebut you or attempt to correct or overturn your reply, rather, I’d simply enjoy an explanation as to how you would speak to such an individual, if you would speak to them at all, since they too have their testimony from the spirit of god. Another example would be the Mormons, who say that the Holy Spirit has told them that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God, and that your scriptures have lost many plain and precious parts, due to which your beliefs and your understanding of the text must be overruled and ultimately corrected by the book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants and the Pearl of Great price. The Spirit has told them these things are true, and has guided them into all truth.
As I wrote, I’m genuinely curious as to how you would speak to such a person about their revelation from god. Thank you for taking the time to read and consider my message, sir.
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Hello oldschool, thanks for writing. I have often thought about the same question. There are so many various beliefs, interpretations and doctrines in our world today. Not only among people in general but among the various christian denominations. You definitely cannot get very many people to agree on things. My feeling is that the Spirit of Christ lives within us and we have to follow what we feel is his leading for us. If someone told me some of the things you mentioned I would quickly say that it does not resonate with my spirit and would dismiss it as only their view or interpretation. I think we can only go with what we feel the Spirit is saying to us and not worry about what everyone else says. Many times we get a feeling of agreement with what someone else says, other times we just are not comfortable with what we hear. I have to say I would tell someone who says something that does not resonate within my spirit that I appreciate their views but I see things a different way, then explain what I am thinking. It is up to each person to take what they hear and accept or reject it. Thanks again for writing.
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Whereas I can write how I appreciate your swift and lengthy reply, many people aren’t so interested to read another poster’s thoughts, I however am. I’d be pleased if you’d humour me with a couple of more questions, since the above person, although a fiction, holds to beliefs which are very real, they’re the beliefs of Jehovah witnesses. This person, for clarity’s sake, denies Jesus is who He claims to be (see John 8:24), in addition to denying that Christ has come in the flesh (1 John 4:2, 2 John 1:7). In light of their beliefs, and your own, I’d like to ask two questions. Firstly, is such a person as that saved in your opinion? By which I mean to write, in plain speak, are they going to heaven? Secondly, if they’re unregenerate and unsaved, yet they have their own burning in the bosom, a sincere testimony, wouldn’t they being left to their own devises only further their state of separation from God, as your advice, which again I’m not going to refute, is council which advises them to seek their own inner light, yet, following their own desires has up until today brought them away from Christ. If they’re misled, as you have shared, wouldn’t advising people to further trust in the things which resonate with their spirit simply be an invitation for them to further and more deeply believe in the things which they believe. If they trust what they believe the spirit is saying to them, a spirit which has misled, would it not be poor advise to tell this person to not be concerned with what others are saying?
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Hello, in regard to your question, my thought is how do we determine who is right and who is wrong? We can say if someone does not accept Jesus Christ then they are lost. We can say we go along with the universalist thought and everyone is saved. For me, my personal feeling is that we are not called to judge who is right, who is saved, or where someone will spend eternity. Jesus said the two greatest commands are to love God and love others. Fortunately none of us are the judge and none of us are going to have to make the decision you mentioned. I feel each of us are responsible for hearing from the Spirit within us and obey accordingly. Apart from that, as followers of Christ we are to love God and love people, whether we agree with them or not. I am so glad I am not responsible for deciding who is right or wrong, I am only to love them the way they are.
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In terms of your question, I’d answer how you’ve already shared in a fashion. Jesus taught “Is it not written?” They presupposed listeners and readers could understand Godly conduct from sinful behaviour by way of the Scriptures. Jesus didn’t teach “Well, there’re the Pharisees, Sadducee, Essenes and the Zealots, too many readings for you to understand anything in the Scriptures.” Rather They taught “Is it not written?” That’s in reply to your question how you and I can know who’s right and wrong with regards to their behaviour.
When you reply you’re only required to love, does this mean you’ve draw your ideas of love from Scripture, or from the Spirit? How have you ascertained the nature of love, sir? To clarify, you’ve judged, by something not resonating with your spirit you’ve made a decision on whether or not that’s from the Spirit, and that’s not to write you’ve condemned anybody, I wouldn’t ask that of you. You’ve simply shown discernment, and that’s appropriate. So, have you gathered an understanding about what it means to love from Scripture, in spite of how many interpretations abound?
My earlier question to do with whether or not such people as those who deny Christ are unsaved isn’t meant to prompt condemnation, nor am I writing the decision as to where they go is upon anybody shoulders except God’s, instead I’m meaning to ask you does the fact that someone is lost resonate with you in the same way that certain other claims resonate. You’ve already made the judgement call about their testimony not coming from God, that’s a fair show of discernment, yet that’s not setting yourself up as God, in the same way I’m asking if the idea of a person being lost because they reject God rings true, insofar as you’re concerned.
Lastly, in case you’ve missed my question, doesn’t it appear that to advise people to not worry about the opinions of others, when their own spirits are leading them away from Jesus, isn’t that unloving or unsafe advice?
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Obviously the traditional teaching of the church says that anyone denying Christ is not saved. As for me, I prefer to show the love of God to all people no matter their beliefs and let any other judging of who is and who is not saved be God’s decision. There are so many various interpretations about living in the Kingdom now, life after death and heaven and hell. Many of these interpretations make sense and can be backed by picking the right bible verses. The truth is, none of us know for sure. We have our interpretation and our belief yet none of us can prove what is right. I prefer to leave that up to God and go on loving people and treating everyone with respect. In regard to advising people not to worry about opinions of others, I do not think it is unloving. I think telling others my views, which is God loves them and has provided grace and forgiveness of their sinful nature is showing love, yet without telling them in a way that my way is the way they have to follow. Each of us has to choose for ourselves what we feel is the right thing to do.
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I hope you find my questions sincere, Jim. I’d like to ask several more, largely because I think you’ve neglected a couple of earlier points of mine, in addition to misreading others. After which I’m going to simply number my questions so that we’re both aided in our replies.
Wouldn’t your ideas about interpreting Scripture lead into something of a Mexican stand-off? When people write Jesus was violent, and intended to “not bring peace, but a sword“, that’s not a matter of my totally valid interpretation versus their totally valid interpretation. Wouldn’t you agree? Rather it’s a matter of exegesis over against eisegesis. Every interpretation isn’t equal just in terms of good hermeneutics, “love thy neighbour” being interpreted as “eat thy neighbour” won’t stand, and I imagine you wouldn’t expect believers to apologise for correcting so poor an “attempt” at reading the scripture. Perhaps other missteps in our readings are more sincere, innocent even, yet, they’re certainly correctable to everyone open enough to learning.
Exegesis (to lead out of) means we’re allowing the material to speak for itself by applying appropriate criteria (e.g. syntax, grammar, genre). Many of these tools of understanding are intuitive. Whereas eisegesis goes into personal desires for the text itself, which often concludes in the mishandling of the scriptures.
When you write many interpretations can appear credible by picking “the right Bible verses”, that’s simply the behaviour of a reader who does eisegesis. That’s refusing to be led by the Spirit, eyewitnesses and apostles who wrote the New Testament. Do you believe there are interpretations of Biblical material which are grounded in proper exegesis?
With which I’d very much like to return to a question of mine. In my earlier message I asked whether or not you had gathered your ideas about what it means to behave lovingly based upon God’s word (Scripture), or a spirit? Lest there’s any confusion, I’m aware you asked in the title to your article “The Word of God, person or book?” Of course the answer is if you’re capping the “w” in Word, by the rules of proper English, we’d be discussing a person, whereas, if you’re simply meaning to write God’s word (small w) it’s a book. 🙂 One is personified and understood as a name. So I ask once more, have you decided on what’s loving behaviour based upon God’s word, or by way of a personal/private revelation? You’re writing how you’ve been the person treating people respectfully, lovingly, and yet, you’re writing nobody’s reading of the Scriptures, wherein you find God’s very revelation of “grace”, “sin nature”, “love” can be justified. When you write you’re respecting people, you’ve necessarily tarred people who act in a contrary way to yourself as disrespectful, it’s like magnets, meaning your views reflect upon more than yourself, sir. You can I believe address my point in light of my earlier question.
1). Isn’t there an obvious difference and superiority between exegesis when compared to the act of scripture mishandling in the form of eisegesis?
2). Didn’t Jesus presuppose Their audience could understand God’s revelation in the scriptures?
3). Didn’t Jesus condemn wicked people for ignoring and subverting God’s commands as found in the scriptures? (which presupposes they could rightly interpret such commands).
4). Don’t you presuppose reading comprehension and proper exegesis just for replying to my messages?
5). Do you believe there are interpretations of Biblical material which are grounded in proper exegesis?
6). Have you gathered your ideas about what it means to behave lovingly based upon God’s word (Scripture), or a spirit?
7). Do you believe in eternal separation from God? (AKA Hell).
8). Do you believe anybody goes there? (Again, my friend, this is a different question from asking you whether or not certain specific people are doomed. I’m just asking hypothetically).
9). How can you discern whether or not your own ideas are in harmony with God’s commands by revelation in light of the notion that nobody can justify their interpretation of the scriptures?
You’ve concluded by writing about how you’re loving by not sharing how your way is the way, however, isn’t it true that you’re not supposed to be leading people into your way, or my way, rather you’re supposed to be sharing with people the way, the truth, and the life. Isn’t that true?
Best wishes and I look forward to a well considered reply.
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I know your are sincere in your questions and I appreciate you reading and commenting on my articles. Yet as I mentioned early on, I do not enjoy the continual back and forth questioning and debate. I only write my opinions and feelings and certainly do not expect others to agree with me. I also know they are only my opinion and I am not trying to teach or say my way is right, it is just where I am at the moment. I certainly remain open to the Spirit to guide me into more truth in his time. I enjoy people commenting and posting views, and am happy for more people to jump in and take part, but for me to continue to try and answer all your questions and go back and forth is not enjoyable to me. I write because I enjoy writing. Yet if I do not enjoy the continual back and forth I would rather not participate in that part rather than stop doing something I enjoy. I guess if I was doing this for a living I might feel differently, but since I do this for enjoyment I will have to stick to what I enjoy and keep my commenting to a smaller part. I certainly understand that people may be frustrated with this opinion and I know it may mean people will stop following my articles. I do not intend on driving people away but if that is the case I certainly understand. I want to enjoy what I do rather than not enjoy it and stop writing. I’m sure you will understand. Thanks again for commenting.
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I appreciate the length of time in which you’ve exchanged with me, Jim, however contentious I might at times appear to be. I also don’t do anything I do professionally, rather, every message, whether they’re clumsy or slick, impactful or ineffective, is of my own initiative and born out of my love for people.
I own a book, it’s called “the kingdom interlinear translation of the Greek Scripture”, and it’s a perversion of our Bible. It was originally published by the famous cult of Jehovah Witnesses in 1969 (nearly 20 years before I was born). Their rendering of John 1:1 reads “In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was [a] god.” I was raised being taught lies by these people, and today I mark this dusty purple book masquerading as a Bible. We can use it’s falsehood to teach others, and yet, because these exchanges can become so heated so fast, I wrote in the front of the book, inside the cover just for myself to read, “Jesus loves them.” That how I want to begin every discussion, God forgive me if, or when, I fall short of that desire.
I’m sharing the above because, make no mistake, my friend, thinking less of God’s word, and less of your calling, it’s an unbelievers loss, it’s to their hurt that we don’t speak and teach in whatever measure we’ve been gifted talent to teach and speak. Disbelief of God’s word to humanity means Christ is lost to these people, and they need Him, I write from past experience, they need Him. I’d like to share a video with you, and if you have time, please open your Bible, read along with the lecture.
Again, I appreciate your time, and if you’d like, you don’t need to post this comment of mine, if it’s helpful, this can simply be my private encouragement to you. God bless you, sir.
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I certainly have no bad feelings about you or your writing. I am just one that does not like debates or constantly explaining myself. I just enjoy writing about how I feel at this point in my walk with God. I know we are all at different places as we follow our Father, yet I love and respect my brothers and sisters in Christ even in our differences. I can certainly understand your feelings after the background you mentioned. I also do not mean to sound like I take the bible lightly, I just think we sometimes put more importance on it rather than in Christ. You are certainly always welcome to post comments here. I certainly appreciate comments, even though I don’t respond with to much depth. Thanks.
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