Done with Religion

Can I Still Be In With God If Doubt God, Jesus, The Bible, Afterlife?

May 12, 2024 by What God May Really Be Like

By Mike Edwards

You may not want to read this Post if you never question or doubt if God is real, if everything the Bible claims about God is true, and you are convinced hell or heaven is a certainty. For some though it is normal to struggle to believe in an invisible God, to wonder if Jesus really resurrected from the dead since they weren’t there. No one can prove if there is really an afterlife after death. God never informed Old Testament writers of such a place. See here. Some may have questions after hearing different opinions in biblical scholarship. Many didn’t grow up with religious teaching and so rightly wonder claims made by religious folks. Is there a reason to follow God with so many doubts or questions?

What if I am not sure the stories of Jesus resurrected from the dead are true?

I currently am convinced Jesus’ resurrection isn’t legend and has historical verification, but others may not. I don’t believe God hates me if I change my mind. Jesus’ disciples didn’t believe Jesus was coming back from the dead, despite witnessing Jesus’ miracles beforehand, until seeking Jesus after his death with their own eyes. I would like to think many of us seeing a man or woman coming back from the grave, after killed on a cross, would be convinced. I have a hunch God cares the most that you believe in the possibility of a loving God to begin a faith journey.

Who was Jesus really?

One may read, if not reading only conservation Christian viewpoints, that the Jesus’ sayings for accuracy in the Gospels has many problems. After all, the biblical writers wrote 40 years later what Jesus supposedly said through oral traditions handed down. You should read what my kids claim I said decades ago! Maybe it doesn’t matter if the biblical writers 40 years later recorded Jesus’ words exactly. Today, we take things so literally. Maybe back in NT times, they were writing not for historical accuracy but weaving a story about what they thought Jesus was trying to teach (the meaning behind the text).

Does the Bible always get God right?

Ever read the Bible closely. Claims made about God don’t seem like a loving God. Leaders tout that God inspired/approved all written in the Bible, yet some actions contributed to God by the writers make no moral sense. Unfortunately, newcomers will be directed to read the Bible and be horrified reading about some of God’s supposed actions. Rationalizations are given to explain such actions about God to protect God’s inspiration of the Bible (writers understood God perfectly). I suggest instead considering if biblical writers always understood God correctly. See here.

Is following God worth it with so many questions?

I am convinced living a godly life is worth it, even if God doesn’t exist. Go ahead and live like Hell while here on earth! You may have fun but your loved ones won’t. God only wants to help pursuing a life not full of regrets. Personally, following what I believe a loving God to be like has inspired and encouraged me to be the person I desire to be. The journey is worth it. Most are convinced Jesus was a very real person who lived in the first century. Let’s debate his teachings. We are often told the main message of the Bible is Jesus coming to save you from Hell. I am convinced Jesus spoke of loving God not to get into heaven but to receive help in loving others as you love yourself here on earth. What do we have to lose treating one another like we want to be treated?

Can I Still Be In With God If Doubt God, Jesus, The Bible, Afterlife?

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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Why Don’t We Want To Call Ourselves A Christian Nation (Christian Nationalism)?

May 5, 2024 by What God May Really Be Like

By Mike Edwards

The Founders of America referred to God/Creator in the Declaration of Independence. They also referred to the “Laws of Nature.” The Founders fled to have freedom from Government control or tyranny, so they certainly would advocate for freedom of religious beliefs or that atheists shouldn’t be discriminated against. Christians leaders and others are often falsely accused of forcing beliefs on others by declaring their Christian heritage, but Christians aren’t always careful in their language. Declaring we are a Christian nation implies lack of freedom in religious beliefs.

A Christian label doesn’t respect God’s freedom of belief

The presence of so much evil in the world suggests God has given us freedom to choose from the beginning. God understood forced love is an oxymoron. Without freedom we could accuse God of not creating the very best world where only true, authentic relationships can develop. It may be suggested that God eventually gets you by lighting infidels on fire and not allowing it to burn out in the afterlife. Christians must reject such a view of Hell. Now, when one meets their Creator and rejects living a loving/godly life, I can see them being allowed to pass into final death. I wrote here that Hell (a place of forever punishment) is doubtful biblically and morally from a loving God.

Even Jesus didn’t advocate for a Christian nation

Most Christians argue that to understand Jesus is to understand God. Jesus didn’t attempt to overthrow the Roman Empire to establish a “Christian” nation. Jesus came to influence others to love as they want to be loved. Jesus spoke how to start living here on earth, not what awaited in the afterlife, when asked how to have eternal life. He simply said to love God and your neighbor (Lk10:25-37). Jesus knew loving God led to loving your neighbor. If one is so inclined, they can ask for God’s help in living a meaningful life here on earth.

Christians often assume truth only comes from a Book

How can there be a Christian nation if Christians disagree what such a worldview is? Christian leaders of companies or religious institutes often claim they are guided or adhere to biblical principles. This implies biblical understandings are agreed upon by all who follow the Bible, and non-followers have less than ideal morals. Ancient literature subject to human interpretation cannot be the definitive word on truth. Besides, it can’t be proven one’s God inspired all written down about God in their cherished book. I’m not convinced the writers always understood God perfectly. See here.

Good and evil has arisen because of how the Bible or other religious Books have been interpreted or viewed. Biblical scholars who respect Scriptures don’t agree what the Bible teaches about many moral values – women rights, gay condemnation, and the afterlife. See here. See here. See here. Some Religions’ Books are interpreted that God authorizes killing infidels in this life, not just suffer consequences in the afterlife. Again, it can’t be proven Prophets always understood God correctly. Common moral sense isn’t the enemy!

Where do our rights come from – who’s on Top?

If one’s Creator exist and is perfectly loving, natural law and God’s laws should be one and the same. Moral values are not determined by a Book, popular opinion, or by a few in power. There are universal values that most rational people agree on such as murder, stealing, equal rights for all, etc. We may disagree what should be the punishment for breaking certain laws. That must be debated openly. Most religions agree the overriding moral guide is to love others like you want to be treated. Belief or lack of belief in God doesn’t give you an excuse to not treat others like you want to be treated. Perfect rights or laws demonstrate loving others like we want to be love. Even atheists would agree.

We don’t all agree what the most loving actions are. It is a bit naïve for any nation to claim our values must be biblically based, as if all agree what the Bible says about abortion, gays, capital punishment, etc. The equal rights of women with men in many Nations are denied because of a Book. Regardless of your faith, most rational beings agree on many universal moral values (murder, stealing). And no – climate control, immigration, taxes, health care, are not universal laws. The problem in the U.S. is debate is frowned up and attempts are made to censor contrary opinions.

Is there a Nation we could all agree on?

We are neither a God or godless nation. Censoring belief in God or unbelief in God is all the same. If suggested God is not above all, then neither is State/Government on top as a god. An ideal nation is surely free to believe in a Creator or not believe in a Creator. Christian politicians often claim or imply our rights are given by God. We can attempt to avoid accusations of Christian nationalism by clarifying our beliefs are personal not universal. Self-evident rights may be found in a Book or natural law, as we all have an inborn sense of good and evil. No rational being argues sexual abuse isn’t evil. Freedom of beliefs is our foundation to decide democratically the more caring action in policy.

I believe the Declaration of Independence and Constitution makes the U.S. unique from most other countries. We all have “unalienable rights” and not rights according to Government, Dictators or one’s understanding of a perfect, loving God. In our Republic, the Government is limited in taking away certain rights of the people. A true Democracy allows representation through voting, though the Constitution and Bill of Rights safeguard individual rights such as freedom of speech – protection from majority power over the minority. A true debate of differing opinions is out best chance at arriving at the most caring decision for all concerned. Until we all ask ourselves “am I acting toward others like I want to be treated,” we seem destined to fail.

Why Don’t We Want To Call Ourselves A Christian Nation (Christian Nationalism)?

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How Do We Pursue “Truth” That Will Heal A Nation?

April 28, 2024 by What God May Really Be Like

By Mike Edwards

Claiming Truth falsely can be destructive. Many Christian leader claim that we as a people and nation must rely on biblical truth. Can we always know what biblical truth is? Attempts have been made to censor mis-informers in the public arena. Can we always know what misinformation is concerning science or political policies? We must be careful what we claim as Truth and how we interact with others during uncertainty.

What is scientific or biblical truth?

The bedrock of science use to be considering hypotheses to explain a phenomenon in the natural world. It is an educated guess based on the information we have currently have and could change if we get new information in the future. Drugs are often approved initially, only to be pulled from the shelves later after causing death. The truth is that it isn’t science if there isn’t debate!

Ancient literature subject to interpretation cannot be the definitive word on truth. Besides, even if all agreed that the Bible correctly interpreted confirms God condemns gays or forbids women in leadership in religious institutes, we cannot prove that the writers always portrayed God accurately. Any biblical truth claimed must also agree with natural truth such as sexual abuse is evil; otherwise, we must purse truth with an open mind.

Are there self-evident truths we can agree on?

No, one can’t just follow their own heart! What reasonable or rational person doesn’t expect the golden rule from others in their own relationships. Our inborn sense of good and evil, not an ancient Book, tells us sexual abuse or murder is immoral. Most criminals don’t defend their murders or thefts; instead, they deny committing such crimes. We don’t debate many laws, only what is a just punishment. It is a dictatorship not a democracy when we impose our will on issues such as pandemic responses, taxes, climate change, immigration, etc. Dictatorships don’t end well. Benefits and risks exist for most issues.

Freedom of speech is critical

Denying free expression of belief is playing Superior in the lives of others. God is the example for God-believers. God has respected freedom of beliefs from the very beginning; otherwise, God who is powerful enough to create would annihilate immediately those who oppose God by choosing evil. Freedom is necessary for authenticity, the highest good in relationships, or we could accuse God of not creating the “best” world. A true debate of differing opinions, regardless if you think one is a heretic or conspiracist, is our best chance at arriving at the most caring decision for all concerned. Until we all ask ourselves “am I acting toward others like I want to be treated,” we are destined to fail. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t confront those who reject freedom of speech!

Uncertainty can be a good thing

Certainty rather than uncertainty comforts individuals psychologically. One may believe the seemingly certain narrative because unknowing can create anxiety. When only one side is presented, control and power grow intentionally or unintentionally. It should be intuitive denying diverse opinions is unloving and controlling. Couples who act as if they are always right and their partner is wrong are headed toward divorce. Having good intentions by believing you are right for the whole doesn’t matter when certainty isn’t universal. God-followers and religious leaders seem hell-bent in telling people what they must believe about God according to their understanding and interpretation of the Bible. Politicians seem hell-bent in claiming certainty regarding policies such as climate change and immigration, though there are arguments on both sides.

Should we avoid those who claim certainty and don’t pursue truth civilly?

One has every right to question when one claims certainty regarding non-self-evident truths. Even evil people don’t think others can violate their rights in ways that they violate others. A refusal to openly discuss or defend one’s views suggest an unhealthy dependency on “certainty.” If someone makes false claims of those who oppose them such as calling them racists, without being able to give specific examples, are they really interested in pursuing truth? How about “they have a different opinion!”

What are necessary paths to pursing truth?

There are truths which almost has universal agreement. Do you know one person who denies adultery is wrong except the betrayer?

Shouldn’t Christian leaders quit always claiming their biblical interpretation is correct and at least acknowledge literature requires interpretation “according to their understanding?”
Shouldn’t we examine all Books about religion to discern what seems the most universally true? What are Christians afraid of if they have the truth?
Shouldn’t we listen to everyone’s opinion and seek to discern together what is the most loving action according to the circumstances?
Shouldn’t we first stop claiming our views are morally superior to those we disagree with unless speaking of universal accepted moral truths
Shouldn’t we can begin conversations by looking for areas we agree?
Shouldn’t we discuss differences by defending our reasoning, respecting the opinions of others, and commit to growing in understanding
Shouldn’t we stop labeling those who disagree with our biblical interpretations as heretics?
Shouldn’t we can stop calling those who disagree with our views of science as conspiracists?

Open-minded uncertainty, rather than supposed certainty, could go a long way to healing our nation and personal relationships. Imagine how different as a people we would be if religious and political folks had open discussions what are the most caring actions for the greater good concerning non-universal matters such as immigration or climate policies. Most religions agree the overriding moral guide is to love others like you want to be treated. Belief or lack of belief in God doesn’t give you an excuse to not treat others like you want to be treated.

How Do We Pursue Truth That Will Heal A Nation?

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Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Jesus follower, Love of God | Tagged acceptance, agreement, Bible, certainty, christian living, Christianity, disagree, interpretations, opinions, politics, religions, science, truth |

Becoming a Religious Heretic – Part 2

April 24, 2024 by DoneWithReligion

by Jim Gordon

As I wrote in my last article ( Part 1 ), over time I have become a religious heretic. I have questioned and thought about many of the things I was taught in church as I grew up. A few other topics I have changed my mind on are listed below.

Again, let me say, the following are my thoughts and opinions. I am not saying I am right or wrong, but is where I am at now. I have changed my views over the past several years, and I will most likely change my views over the next several years. We are all entitled to our opinions and we should accept each other with the opinions we have. We certainly will not all agree.

Creationism: I have changed my mind on this topic, not that I do not believe that God created all things, but I no longer believe God created all things in six literal days. God created, but when, how and how long it took I do not know. I do not think it is wrong or against the biblical teaching to say creation could have taken thousands, even billions of years. A thousand years to God are as one day to us, so obviously God’s timing is not like our timing.

I no longer say that Israel, or the United States as far as the goes, is God’s chosen people. I do not believe God has a chosen people, religion, country or race. God loves the world, and that includes everyone no matter where they live, what religion they follow, if any, what race, what gender, who they love or who they vote for.

I tend to find I chose social justice over religion these days. Many churches do help others in various areas, but I still found while in the church system, more people were focused on trying to get people to church or to accept their way of religious thinking and less about helping the poor, the unaccepted, the immigrants and others who often time were looked down upon and called lazy.

Knowing that Jesus fulfilled the Old Covenant and we now live in an age of grace, I always find it hard to understand why so many religious institutions focus on the ten commandments and following the Old Covenant law. Why are they pushing what the Bible calls a way of death? For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and death. And, now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law.

Another change after leaving organized religion is my acceptance of people who the church normally looked down upon and were not accepted within the religious organization. The LGBTQ family, BIPOC, immigrants and other nationalities and religions. I now have friends and acquaintances from all these groups and totally accept that they were created in the image of God, are totally loved by God just as they are, and we can all learn from one another and treat one another with love and respect. There are no second-class citizens.

So, as you can see, I have changed my views on many things over the past few years. I think that is a good thing. I think we need to stay fresh and open to the leading of the Spirit to lead us in new ways as more truth is revealed to us. I am sure there will be more changes over the years as my wife and I walk with God outside the walls of religion. Obviously, these are all only my opinions and views. I may be right or I may be wrong. I do not force these views on anyone else. Each of us are free to choose for ourselves what we believe. What we are to do is love one another even in our differences, accept each other as we are and live life trying to help and encourage our fellow human beings along the way.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, deconstruction, institutional church, Jesus follower, Love of God, religion, The church | Tagged Bible, BIPOC, christian living, Christianity, church, creationism, grace, heretic, LGBTQ, Love of God, Old Covenant, religion, ten commandments |

What Is The Greatest Misunderstanding About Jesus?

April 21, 2024 by What God May Really Be Like

By Mike Edwards

It is often assumed Jesus is speaking directly to you when recorded speaking to an audience in the Bible! Jesus’ words don’t always apply to every situation in one’s life 2000 years later. Jesus often used hyperbole for emphasis without stating exceptions: “But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment”(Mt 5:22). Was Jesus subjecting himself to judgment when calling out religious hypocrites – “you blind fools” (Mt 23:17)? Sounds angry to me! God is mad as hell as you are in certain situations. Discern if your angry is what Jesus is addressing.

Did Jesus think we should always turn the other cheek?

Sermons are preached advising we must always “turn the other cheek” (Mt 5:39). Scholars have suggested a possible literal translation of Mt. 5:39 is “do not resist by evil means.” Nations can defend against evil dictators. We shouldn’t rape and torture those captured as some enemies do. Jesus isn’t advocating domestic violence if a woman is being abused by a man. There may be times to seek justice and others times to resist.

Did Jesus think we must always forgive?

Jesus is often represented saying we must always forgive. Should we always forgive those who deny their evil actions? Isolation can bring one to their moral sense and prevent further abuses. Every situation is different. The Bible also says God forgives if we forgive others (Mt. 6:14-15). Forgive if they repent (Lk. 17:3). For some forgiving can cause feelings of further victimization and bitterness; for others forgiving can control bitterness and possible acts of revenge. God may not be as non-empathetic as thought. Seek the mind of God what actions in relationship difficulties lead to your best interest in a world full of disappointments.

Did Jesus really condemn all religions?

Jesus said: “I am the way, the truth, and the life, no one comes to the Father except through me” (Jn 14:6). Did Jesus really mean God only saves those who accept Jesus? Keep in mind the majority of people born into this world have never heard of Jesus or had a Bible. This verse could easily be interpreted to mean Jesus’ way of life is the best path toward God. The path to God is through love. (See God After Deconstruction, Oord/Fuller Chapter 9). We Christians need to be less condemning and more open to God’s love and message to people of all religions.

How to read the Bible

Read the Bible to discern for yourselves, perhaps with the help of friends, what the application is in your circumstances. Consider how to go the extra mile. Consider what actions might possibly lead to reconciliation or change in hearts if others open. The Bible isn’t a question-and-answer Book. Besides, there are different opinions on meaning and application of the same passage. The Bible was never meant to be a rules book but for reflection in one’s circumstances. The Bible is valuable because it suggests handling certain circumstances from a spiritual than human perspective. It challenges us to a life of love and treating others like we want to be treated!

What Is The Greatest Misunderstanding About Jesus?

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Posted in Bible, christian living, Love of God | Tagged Bible, christian living, Christianity, Jesus, Love of God | 1 Comment »

Becoming a Religious Heretic – Part 1

April 17, 2024 by DoneWithReligion

by Jim Gordon

Yes, I admit it. I have become a religious heretic. So, what is a heretic? According to the dictionary, it is a person holding an opinion at odds with what is generally accepted; the formal denial or doubt of a core doctrine of the Christian faith as defined by one or more of the Christian churches.

First let me say, the following are my thoughts and opinions. I am not saying I am right or wrong, but is where I am at now. I have changed my views over the past several years, and I will most likely change my views over the next several years. We are all entitled to our opinions and we should accept each other with the opinions we have. We certainly will not all agree.

After spending nearly sixty years in the institutional church (including from the time my parents took me as a baby and young child), my wife and I left the organization because we no longer felt we could completely agree with many of the church doctrines and generally accepted ways of the church. What led up to this decision was the many years within the church that taught me some things that I finally had to question.

I remember I went to church whenever the doors were open. I felt that I was going to God’s house and the Spirit may fall during a service and I did not want to miss it. I felt the pastor was well trained in spiritual matters and he was the middleman between God and me. I looked to the pastor for all the answers and to teach me more about God and what I should be doing.

Obviously, I believed that Christianity was the only way to know God and to be a true follower of Jesus. I always thought that Jesus came to start a new religion that would be the only correct way to follow him and only those who followed that religion would be saved.

I always held the Bible in very high regard. I felt it was dictated by God to humans, who carefully wrote everything down so we would have a perfect book about God. It was a love story and a rule book that would guide us each day of our lives. I believed the Bible was the true, inerrant and perfect word of God and it was clear on what it said.

I was one who believed people needed to get right with God or they would end up in Hell after they passed from this earth. Hell was created for the Devil and his angels, but people who rejected God would end up there also. Hell was also a great way to make people afraid enough to make a decision for Christ and boost church attendance.

How many times have we been told that God is our father, a male figure sitting on a throne in Heaven watching down on us, just waiting for us to mess up so he can punish us. If God did not see Jesus in us, then we were all doomed. Even Jesus called him father, so what else could he be?

Now, after becoming totally unsatisfied with what I had always been taught, I started to ask questions and seek answers from someone other than the pastor. I found books and podcasts of others who had other interpretations and views that really made sense. I found many people who had left the institution and were asking questions and finding answers other than the traditional ones the church always taught.

I came to see that church is not God’s house after-all, and the Spirit does not fall at specific places or at certain times. We the people are the church. We are the temple of the Holy Spirit who came to live within us once and for all. The Kingdom of God is within us. The church as we know it is just a building where people meet to fellowship and learn about God, but it is not necessary to attend and there is nothing wrong with not attending if you so choose.

I know there are many religions in the world and that Christianity was not started by Jesus. It is just another man-made organization, but based on the person of Jesus. There are many religions and I believe we can learn from each of them. I believe if Jesus walked the earth today, he would not be a Christian nor attend a church. He would be accepting of all people no matter their personal religious beliefs.

I found that the Bible never claims to be the Word of God, and never claims to be inerrant. The Holy Spirit is our teacher and our guide. John wrote that in the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God. He also added the word became flesh and dwelt among us. That certainly is not a book. We can learn from the Bible because it is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, yet it is not dictated by God and it is not inerrant. I personally feel that the Bible has a lot of allegory and parables that point out spiritual truth, but it is not always actual events.

In regard to hell, I began to wonder how can a God of love create such a place. In the Bible, when it talks about hell (actually Gehenna) it was talking about a dumping ground/sacrificial area outside of Jerusalem. The idea of such a place has its origins in early Christianity, where those who rejected Christ were threatened with eternal torture in a lake of fire, called Tartarus or Gehenna (from Greek mythology and a nearby trash pit, respectively). I think that the theory of hell was started by the early church as a scare tactic to bring people into the church. Hell is a fear-based topic, but we know that perfect love casts out fear. Love draws and there is nothing about love in the theory of hell.

I believe that God is not some super-hero man sitting in heaven watching down on everyone. God is Spirit and the Spirit of God lives within us. God does have male and female traits, but God is not a male nor female. We are the temple; the Spirit of God lives within us. Could it be that the writers of the Bible were following what was common in their day, where women were property and only men were worthy. Did they use their prejudices when writing what would become the Bible by referring to God as male and Father? Personally, I think so. It is all written from a male perspective.

So, as you can see, I am definitely considered a heretic among the traditional Christian church-goers. I have no ill-will toward any of them. At one point, I was where they are now in my beliefs, but I no longer accept or follow the traditional doctrines taught within most churches today. I do follow the example of Jesus of loving God and loving others.

Obviously, these are all only my opinions and views. I may be right or I may be wrong. I do not force these views on anyone else. Each of us are free to chose for ourselves what we believe. What we are to do is love one another even in our differences, accept each other as we are and live life trying to help and encourage our fellow human beings along the way.

Posted in Bible, christian living, institutional church, Jesus follower, Kingdom of God, Love of God, religion, The church, Word of God | Tagged Bible, christian living, Christianity, church, gehenna, heaven, hell, heretic, Holy Spirit, House of God, institutional church, Love of God, male dominance, pastor, religion |

Is God’s Love Different Than Perfect Human Love?

April 14, 2024 by What God May Really Be Like

By Mike Edwards

No one can definitively say what exactly God’s love is like. Surely the only God worth believing in must be perfectly loving as opposed to in any way hateful. Isn’t it only intuitive to think that if there is a Creator, that a Creator loves the ways their creations should love one another. We all seem to know the question we ought to ask ourselves – am I loving others perfectly. Surely, perfect human love is the same as Godly love.

How handle different biblical opinions?

A Book cannot be the sole determinate of what God’s love is like since ancient literature is subject to interpretation. Reasonable interpreters don’t agree that God in the Bible condemns gays, that God restricts the roles of women in religious institutions, that God condemns unbelievers in this life to a fiery, torturous existence in the afterlife. See here. See here. See here. We must handle our biblical differences without dogmatically claiming our interpretation is right. The question to ask is if you were in someone’s shoes (gay, woman, non-Christian), how would you want to be loved? Such thoughts should influence our interpretation.

How handle different political opinions?

Political differences are often handled similarly to biblical differences. We claim certainty, though there can be genuine debate, and we throw around labels such as heretic or conspiracist. Reasonable people don’t agree how to handle climate change challenges. The same with what is the most compassionate – an open or closed border. We must respect one’s another freedom to have their own opinion. Denying free expression of belief is playing Superior in the lives of others. A true debate of differing opinions, regardless if you think one is a heretic or conspiracist, is our best chance at arriving at the most caring decision for all concerned.

What was Jesus’ thoughts on God’s love?

Many, including me, are convinced to understand Jesus is to understand God. It seems Jesus came to suggest salvation is a current life of love, not a future destination to avoid Hell. Jesus told the woman who had committed adultery: “go now, and leave your life of sin” (John 8). Where was Jesus’ evangelical spiel? Jesus was asked by a religious expert how to have eternal life. He simply said to love God and your neighbor (Lk.10:25-37), since loving God leads to loving others. Jesus confronted the religious who kept laws but didn’t follow Jesus with their heart. Godly love seeks to empower us to be the unselfish people we deep down desire to be for a better world. See here.

Is human or godly love really a mystery?

We all have yearnings to be treated how we seem to know how we ought to treat others. What reasonable or rational person doesn’t expect the golden rule from others in their own relationships. Our inborn sense of good and evil, not an ancient Book, tells us sexual abuse or murder is immoral. Many in the public arena throw out derogatory labels when others don’t share their same view on less than obvious universal truths. Try that in your personal relationships! People deep down know how to handle disagreements. Until we all ask ourselves “am I acting toward others like I want to be treated,” we are destined to fail.

Is God’s Love Different Than Perfect Human Love?

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Posted in Bible, christian living, Love of God | Tagged Bible, christian living, Christianity, golden rule, Love of God |

Jesus Didn’t Die To Save You From Hell – Why Then?

April 7, 2024 by What God May Really Be Like

By Mike Edwards

Has the real Gospel been hijacked? Church folks have been told forever that Jesus’ life and death on the Cross was to spare us from going to Hell to appease God’s anger about our sins. Can human, much less spiritual relationships, be built on fear and anger rather than love and grace? No wonder many don’t want to talk to us God-folks. We are too busy trying to save them from a fiery afterlife rather than discussing how God’s presence in our life now helps us become more the person we desire to become deep down. Godly living in this world leads to a meaningful life with less regrets.

Jesus’ message couldn’t be about avoiding Hell and getting into Heaven

Many of us who attended the institutional church were taught that God’s main mission was to save us from hell so we could go to heaven after death here on earth. All we had to do was say a prayer: “Thank you Jesus for dying on the cross for my sins. Please forgive me. I receive You as my Lord and Savior. Help me to live for you.” I can find no place in the Bible where Jesus advised such a prayer or demanded certain confessions to follow Him. The Good News couldn’t be about escaping a fiery, torturous God if such a hell isn’t biblical. See here.

Did Jesus really die on the Cross to appease God’s anger?

Biblical scholars with interpretation expertise suggest many explanations about Jesus’ death. See here. It seems to me that we may still be talking about Jesus’ life about love, because He was willing to die rather than power over others. Jesus’ death rather than His power has inspired billions to live unselfishly. Terrorists blow others up for a message they feel strongly about. Jesus only blew Himself up for a message He believed very strongly in – seek God’s help in loving others like you want to be loved.

If Jesus had to die to appease God, why did Jesus pray to not have to die (Mt. 26:39)?
How does an innocent person suffering really atone for another person’s sins? It doesn’t make “loving sense” to forgive a child by punishing another child.
If Jesus’ death was required for forgiveness, why in the OT did God often forgive the Israelites? In the New Testament Jesus forgave others before dying on the Cross (Mt. 9:2; Lk. 7:48, etc.)

God cares the most about helping us to do good not evil in our relationships

Understand Jesus, understand God! Jesus didn’t speak of a certain prayer to repeat. Jesus commended Zacchaeus for recognizing a journey necessary to avoid personal destruction. Salvation is not a future destination but a currently reality (Lk 19). Jesus told the woman who had committed adultery: “go now, and leave your life of sin” (John 8). When Jesus was asked by a religious expert how to have eternal life, He simply said to love God and your neighbor (Lk.10:25-37). Loving God leads to loving others. Jesus hung with the despised to reveal God’s love for all. Jesus confronted the religious who kept laws but didn’t follow Jesus with their heart. Jesus sought changes of the heart for the good of the world.

How can God help us?

A relationship with God isn’t a future but current reality. Surely a loving God seeks to encourage us to pursue heavenly than worldly ways here on earth. God seeks to empower us to be the unselfish people we deep down desire to be. Maybe Jesus thought dying unjustly, rather than miraculously jumping off the Cross, revealed evil and God’s willingness to suffer with us and help. Who kills someone for simply claiming to be God? Many of us need to feel forgiven for the behaviors we have committed. God is dying to forgive you of wrong doing in hopes to inspire you to change for your interests and the interests of others.

Jesus Didn’t Die To Save You From Hell – Why Then?

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Posted in Acceptance, christian living, Love of God | Tagged atonement, christian living, Christianity, ff0000, gospel, heaven, hell, Jesus, Love of God |

So Many Divisions within the church

April 3, 2024 by DoneWithReligion

by Jim Gordon

It is sad that Christianity is divided into so many different groups. We all have a little different interpretation of the Bible and a little different understanding of doctrine. Obviously, we are not going to agree on everything, but we certainly should be able to love one another and accept each other even when we differ on these things.

It is hard to understand why there are so many divisions when God tells us we are to be one, as Jesus and God are one. Yet, we understand that we are human and it is easy to lose sight of our first love. If we could only stay focused on Christ, listening for his voice and the guidance of the Spirit, loving God and loving others as God intended, then we could begin to look past our differences.

The problem seems to be that we are unwilling to see any other viewpoint other than our own. There are those such as my wife and I that do not attend an organized church. There are those who attend a church every time the doors are open. Some attend a house church, some meet with fellow believers at cafe’s, parks or restaurants, and others meet in their homes over dinner. We should accept these differences and love one another rather than argue over who is right and who is wrong.

There really is not a right or wrong way to assemble together and we need to stop expecting everyone to do things exactly the same way. We should respect the viewpoints of others and focus on loving them rather than expecting them to see things our way.

Things will not change until we start focusing on what is common in our lives rather than the differences. The common focus should be on Christ, the head of the body. After that, we should focus on loving others rather than arguing about the differences in interpretation.

We should also keep in mind that we are all constantly changing as God brings new truth to us. We are all learning and changing as we are ready to accept new truths. The interpretations I had five years ago are completely different from some of the interpretations I have now. I am sure in another five years they will change again as God leads me into more truth.

Sometimes we are afraid to accept the opinions and interpretations of those who are outside of our belief system because we feel if we do not hold to our way of thinking, we are compromising and not standing up for what we believe. We do not have to give up how we interpret the Bible, but neither should we think everyone else is wrong. Besides, we really are not responsible for leading others into our truth, or convicting them of sin, or even saving them. That is the job of the Holy Spirit. We are told to love God and love others.

When we realize we are each equally important functioning parts of the body, and Christ is the head, we can start to change how we feel about those who do not see things exactly the way we do. We can begin to accept our brothers and sisters in Christ as they are, as we realize we are walking as one with the purpose of sharing the love of God.

Posted in Acceptance, christian living, institutional church, Jesus follower, religion, The church | Tagged acceptance, Bible, christian living, Christianity, church, community, institutional church, Love of God, spirituality |

What One Belief Only Matters To God?

March 30, 2024 by What God May Really Be Like

By Mike Edwards

Acceptance of certain creeds or doctrines is often expected to join a church. They may concern whether the Bible is inspired by God, how one obtains salvation, afterlife beliefs, etc. This is why thousands of denominations exist in the Christian faith. Certain beliefs are declared important according to their interpretation of the Bible. I am convinced God would encourage only one doctrine.

Jesus’ message was simply to love one another

Many agree to understand Jesus is to understand God. Jesus in his interactions didn’t seem to demand a certain prayer to repeat for salvation. Jesus in choosing disciples simply asked to follow him. They didn’t believe many of Jesus’ claims until after his resurrection. I am convinced Jesus came to advise how to start living here on earth, not what awaited in the afterlife, when asked how to have eternal life. He simply said to love God and your neighbor (Lk10:25-37). Jesus understood loving God leads to loving your neighbor. One, if so inclined, can ask for God’s help in living a meaningful life here on earth. See here for more of Jesus’ interactions with others.

What about women, gays, and Hell?

It is assumed biblical scholars agree what the Bible says about gays, women, hell, and other moral issues. They don’t! See here. See here. See here. Ancient literature subject to interpretation cannot be the definitive word on truth. Gays are often condemned and women’s leadership roles are limited, despite their gifts, in God’s name. How would God love gays, women, or those of other religions? A Creator surely loves the way creatures intuitively think they ought to love. How to love others is the discussion, not one’s interpretation which may be wrong.

Self-evident rights may be found in a Book or natural law, as we all have an inborn sense of good and evil. All rational being believe sexual abuse is evil. We can though have healthy debates what climate policies are for the greater good. We can share our personal beliefs in God and other matters in the public arena without implying we all agree what the most loving values are. Love is complicated sometimes. Freedom of beliefs is critical for such discussions.

Does one have to believe Jesus resurrected or was the Son of God?

I imagine most seek to convene together in a church building because of their belief in God and Jesus’ main message. Many may not be sure if Jesus was God in human form or God’s representative here on earth. I am convinced Jesus’ resurrection isn’t legend and has historical verification, but others may not. Jesus’ disciples didn’t believe Jesus when told he was coming back from the dead, despite witnessing Jesus’ miracles beforehand, until witnessing with their own eyes. I would like to think many of us witnessing a man or woman coming back from the grave, after killed on a cross, would be convinced. I have a hunch God cares the most that you believe in the possibility of a loving God to begin a faith journey.

How Christians can unite

Christians often hope others entertain the difference a personal relationship with God can make in one’s life. The way Christians act in loving others can be a distraction to this hope. Christians must forget any requirements of beliefs other than a desire to love others as they wish to be love. God can hold Their own in influencing others to consider God’s help in this journey. Let the discussions how to love begin without assuming you are right and others are wrong!

What One Belief Only Matters To God?

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