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Posts Tagged ‘Love of God’

By Mike Edwards

I write on this subject ad nauseum. In fact, years ago I named my site  What God May Really Be Like.  I used the word “may” because I didn’t want to do what frustrates me most about the institutional church. They act as if they are certain what an invisible, inaudible God is like, yet there are thousands of denominations with difference understandings of God. What one believes about God may be a main reason many don’t purse a closer a relationship with God.  See here.  

The Bible can’t be the only source to know God 

The Bible can’t be an end-all. The Bible as literature has to be interpreted and many disagree claims made about God regarding moral issues – gays, women, and the destiny of people of other religions. See here. To claim the “Bible says” is frankly a little naïve.  Besides, even if we agreed on interpretation, we can’t prove God controlled the thoughts and writing of the writers of the Bible in conveying a perfect view of what God was like. But I’m grateful for the recorded history of God with the Israelites as it gets me thinking about what God is really like.

Our moral intuitions aren’t the enemy!

It is only intuitive that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. Many of us are into God but many of us left the institutional church because claims about God’s character was contrary to our deepest moral intuitions. Why believe in a God you can’t respect. We may not always know what perfect love entails but we seem to know the question we ought to ask ourselves – am I loving others perfectly? Or am I loving others like I want to be loved? Any God worth believing in must be a perfect. What might that perfection look like?

What relationship give us the most insight into God? 

What human relationship comes to mind when thinking of a Creator’s relationship with their creations? Is it the employer-employee relationship, the marriage partnership, or the parent-child relationship? I think the latter. Perfect love from a God or parent is surely one and the same. God’s love surely is other-directed not self-consumed. It is true we don’t all agree or know how a perfect parent responds, but a perfect parent or God surely hopes for my success, believes in me, pulls for me even when failing. Why doesn’t God make it crystal clear what God expects from us? God’s overpowering presence may only lead to fearful obligations to obey. The road traveled of learning and reflecting about God better may lead to lasting convictions. God may speak to us in non-dramatic was out of love!

How Do We Best Determine What God Is Really Like?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

National polls suggest the majority of people believe there is a God. Many seem to have a strong inclination that there is an afterlife after time here on earth. I’m all “in” with God for some reason, but we all have different journeys. I may be needy, scared to accept reality, etc., but how do you explain billions believing in a God. Many would admit they believe in God but don’t have a close relationship with God. I wrote possible reasons why  here .

I have a hunch God especially loves skeptics!

Most agree an unloving or tyrannical God isn’t worth believe in. It is only intuitive, if a Creator exist, that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. A parent obviously loves a child who finds it easier than their others children to accept them and their ways. But we don’t unlove our skeptical children. A greater pain may be when our children ignore us. Spiritual or human parents don’t desire forced love, which isn’t genuine, but hope for consideration and to prove the possibility of a better relationship. 

Don’t believe everything you hear about God? 

Many may be skeptical about God because of claims made about God which are contrary to our deepest moral intuitions. One’s understanding of the Bible may be the reasons some Christians seems unloving. But biblical scholars who have a deep respect for Scriptures don’t agree that the God in the Bible condemns homosexuality, that God forbids women in leadership roles, or that the Bible teaches there is a literal Hell where unbelievers are tortured forever. Don’t believe everything you hear claimed about God! See here.

Do I have to believe in Jesus’ resurrection or that Jesus was both God and human? 

I am convinced Jesus’ resurrection isn’t legend but others may not. Jesus told followers He was coming back from the dead and they didn’t believe Him despite witnessing Jesus’ miracles beforehand. They only believed after witnessing or hearing Jesus resurrected. I would like to think more of us if we witness a man or woman coming back from the grave, after killed on a cross, would be convinced of their message. But none of us lived during biblical times. 

Some can’t logically wrap their heads around Jesus being both man and God. Exactly how does one do that chromosomally? Isn’t it logically impossible to be God and not God? Some may be willing to accept that Jesus was an extraordinary man who epitomized who God was. Why can’t we begin there discussing what teachings of Jesus seem to represent what a loving God is like? 

Don’t we want the Jesus story to be true? 

Jesus didn’t use His power if really God in human form. Who doesn’t respect Jesus was willing to hang out with those despised by society and take on the snobbish religious and political leaders? Jesus, when ask what was the greatest commandment, simply said love others like you want to be loved. Try it! You might have fewer relational regrets. Jesus risked being crucified by the powerful and didn’t bother to save himself from pain on the Cross, though reported capable of miracles. Maybe Jesus wanted other to consider His message. If the biblical writers were making up stuff, you don’t report your leader was crucified, rejected by your family, and followers doubted Jesus’ claims including being God in flesh. Jesus simply was not the stuff legends were made up.

What is the risk of following God?

It’s okay to be skeptical and take a leap of faith. Faith is a part of life. We still get on an airplane, not because we know but have reason to believe it is safe. A God worth believing in only desires to help you in your journey of becoming the person deep down you want to become. I am not sure there is anything to lose in beginning a journey of faith if the desire is to live life with fewer regrets. Personally, the biggest reason for being a God-follower is the inspiration and encouragement I sense in striving to be a better human being than I would be otherwise.

Are There Reasons To Pursue God Even If Skeptical?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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by Jim Gordon

In today’s world, it seems everyone has the ‘I’m number one’ attitude. We are all interested in what is best for us, what makes us happy, how to be more comfortable and satisfied in our lives. Seems like we will do anything to get ahead in life, and to get all the comforts and things to make it easier for us.

Yet, as followers of Christ, we should be doing just the opposite. Our thoughts and attitudes should be about how we can show the love of God to others. What can we do to help those in need, and how can we use the money God has blessed us with to help the less fortunate.

Jesus told us to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, strength and mind and to love others as yourself. While the things we have been given and blessed with by God are not wrong, we need to keep in mind that they are not the important part of our lives. We are to be thinking of others and their need for love, acceptance and encouragement. We are to be concerned about how we can build someone up and meet a need in their life.

The Bible states ‘do not merely look out for your own interests’ — there is nothing wrong with taking thought of our wants, needs and interests, (unfortunately, very often our own interests are all that concern us) — ‘but also for the interests of others.’ May we daily ask God to help us be concerned for others and be ready to care for them as the Spirit leads.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

There are so many views of what God is really like. Many picture God as this angry, judgmental God whose character demands that God is deeply offended when we sin (I hate that “sin” word). See here. The only way God can supposedly like us is to look through their Jesus-colored lens. Others picture God as graceful and loving, ready to forgive on a dime. Where do we get such views?

The Bible doesn’t always help

Both views mentioned are often claimed according to the Bible. The Bible can’t be an end-all. The Bible as literature has to be interpreted and many don’t agree on how God is portrayed in the same passage – even moral issues regarding gays, women, destiny of people of other religions, etc. To claim the “Bible says” is frankly a little naïve.  Besides, even if we agreed on interpretation, we can’t prove God controlled the thoughts and writing of the writers of the Bible, thus having a perfect view of what God was like. But I’m grateful the recorded history of God with the Israelites gets me talking about God. 

Claiming certainty doesn’t help

Many believe the Bible is only how we can know or best know God. This can lead to being dogmatic about one’s views of God. The Bible says God condemns gays. I don’t believe it does but I will except your “maybe” it does. See here.  It is better to be uncertain than wrong about God. One can’t be certain about an inaudible, invisible God. Allow open discussions what a loving God is mostly to be like.   

Why not trust our moral intuitions?

Let’s assume a God exist and created us human beings. Any God worth believing in must be a perfect, loving God. Wouldn’t such a God create us to be perfect, loving humans? Even the Bible implies such an idea: “Be perfect, therefore as your heavenly Parent is perfect” (Mt. 5:48). This passage also agrees with our intuitions – we must have some clue of what true love is. We may not always know what perfect love entails but at least we know the question we ought to ask ourselves – am I loving others perfectly? Or am I loving others like I want to be loved? God’s character surely isn’t contrary to our deepest moral intuitions.

How Can We Get Our View Of God So Wrong Or Right?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

What loving parent demands love. Forced love is an oxymoron. If you believe in not loving people like you want to be loved, good luck in life. I am convinced God only wishes for all to consider the possibility of a loving God who desires to help in our journey to become the person deep down we want to become. Loving, human parents don’t require certain beliefs from their children before hoping they will consider a closer relationship. Are we better lovers than God? 

Does God love skeptics? 

Most agree an unloving or tyrannical God isn’t worth believing in. It is only intuitive, if a Creator exist, that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. A parent obviously loves a child who finds it easier than their other children to accept them and their ways. But we don’t unlove our skeptical children. A greater pain may be when our children ignore us. Spiritual or human parents are always hoping for consideration to prove the possibility of a better relationship. 

Is believing the resurrection of Jesus and Jesus is the Son of God a non-starter? 

I am convinced Jesus’ resurrection isn’t legend but others may not. Jesus told followers He was coming back from the dead and they didn’t believe Him despite witnessing Jesus’ miracles beforehand. They only believed after seeing Jesus resurrected with their own eyes. I would like to think more of us if we witness a man or woman coming back from the grave, after killed on a cross, would be convinced of their message. But none of us lived during biblical times. 

Some can’t logically wrap their heads around Jesus being both man and God. Exactly how does that happen chromosomally? Isn’t it logically impossible to be God and not God? Some may be willing to accept that Jesus was an extraordinary man who epitomized who God was. Why can’t we begin there in discussing what teachings of Jesus seem to represent what a loving God is like? 

You don’t even have to believe the Bible or what it teaches

You certainly don’t have to believe in magical trees and talking snakes. The global flood story could describe a regional flood in hyperbolic terms to convey moral, spiritual food for thought. God doesn’t require literal belief in any event in the Bible or else! Be careful thinking you have to believe what some claim the Bible teaches. Scholars disagree what the Bible teaches about many moral issues, including if there is really a literal hell. See here.  Now if God physically appears before your very eyes, you might want to consider what They claim.

What do you lose taking a leap of faith? 

No one can prove God exist or doesn’t, but billions in the past have believe in the possibility of a Creator. They couldn’t all be lunatics. Do you want to be more in with God? I am not sure there is anything to lose in beginning a journey of faith if the desire is to live life with fewer regrets. Personally, the biggest reason for being a God-follower is the inspiration and encouragement I sense in striving to be a better human being. Give God a chance to influence you positively.

What Beliefs Does God Demand To Be “In” With God?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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by Jim Gordon

Here we are at the end of another year. It can be a time of sadness in some cases, but usually it is a time of excitement and anticipation for a new beginning.

The past happenings of the year are either remembered as sad occurrences or as happy memories. Either way I think they help shape us into the person we are becoming.

Each new year seems to give us a sense of renewed purpose and goals of doing better, whatever that may mean to each of us. For some it is going to the gym, others want to read more or volunteer more. Many want to get closer to God while others want to distance themselves further from religious ways.

We are all different. We all have different ideas on life yet we are so similar in many ways. We all want to be loved and accepted. We all want to be happy and successful in life. We want to have a purpose and fulfill a meaning that is suited for us. My belief is we accept one another the way we are. We are not all going to agree or condone some of the actions of others, but we can still respect and treat each other kindly. We can be friends and still be as different as night and day.

No matter how hard we try, none of us have it all figured out. None of us have it all together and none of us have the right to force others to live, act or believe a certain way just because we think we are right. We are responsible for ourselves, and those of us who are Christians are to let the love of God flow out to all people no matter if they agree with us or not. We are only asked to love God and love one another.

As this is the last post of the year, I wanted to take a minute and thank each of you who take the time to read our articles. There are many different views and thoughts on life among our readers and I know not all agree with what we say…and that is OK. We do not try to force our views on others. We write about how we feel and how we see things at this period of time. Each of us has our own views and opinions and we should be able to share those views and still be accepting of others.

We also want to make sure that no matter who you are, what you believe, no matter what religion, race, sex, gender or nationality, we consider you friends and are glad you take the time to read our articles.

So, until next year, we here at Done with Religion hope each of you have a good holiday season. We are hopeful you will continue to visit our site and find encouragement, acceptance and friendship throughout the new year.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

Many Christians assume the Bible teaches we must forgive without any expectations. The Bible can also be used to claim repentance is required. God does not forgive the rebellious (Josh. 24:19); “… if they repent forgive them” (Lk. 17:3). The Bible wasn’t meant to be a rules book to advise what every individual should do in their circumstances. “Turn the other cheek” is not meant for a domestic victim. One is free to forgive without expectations, but you have come to the right blog if a victim and you think certain expectations are important before forgiving a person.

Doesn’t God expect genuine forgiveness before getting into Heaven?

Many defend that the Bible claims you must always forgive no matter the circumstances. But those who defend easy forgiveness would not agree God forgives without acknowledging any wrongdoing. They would suggest you can’t enter Heaven without seeking forgiveness from God. The assumption is God expects and can discern if you are being genuine in repenting. Maybe even God has certain conditions or expectations if seeking forgiveness. Aren’t we supposed to imitate God?

I am suspicious of those that “just want to move on” 

A bully or abuser who doesn’t acknowledge their behaviors and just wants to move on is suspect. I have hurt others to know how I should go about asking for forgiveness. It isn’t about my feelings but the victim’s feelings. I don’t know why some guilty folks focus on their expectations and not their victim’s. The guilty obviously know they have done something wrong if asking for forgiveness. Those refusing to wrestle with expectations communicated by victims don’t acknowledge the seriousness of their actions. The innocent decides next steps and if a future relationship is possible.

Wrongdoing must be recognized 

If one is not held accountable for their wrongdoing, might they just do it again? Quick or easy forgiveness can allow a husband’s abusive behavior to continue. When a sexual abuser doesn’t openly acknowledge their actions, will they continue to abuse others? The guilty need to stop with excuses or blaming others. Those with the same upbringing or circumstances don’t always mistreat others. The guilty must take responsibility and accept steps a victim wants taken next. 

Restitution isn’t always possible 

Bad memories can’t be erased; positive memories robbed by the guilty can’t be restored. This is why certain relationships cannot always continue.  Those that have hurt others are not in a position to insist on a future relationship. When restitution is possible, discussions are necessary unless the guilty aren’t really sorry. 

To forgive or not!

In my mind forgiveness isn’t really a discussion until the guilty acknowledge they need forgiveness. But for some forgiving despite lack of remorse can control bitterness. For others to forgive despite lack of remorse can cause feelings of further victimization and bitterness. We must stop guilting victims, according to the Bible, to forgive their violator no matter what. Those hurt must seek the mind of God what actions in relationship difficulties lead to your best interest in the long run in a world full of disappointments. You may discover God is emphatic!

Should We Forgive Others Without Expectations?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

National polls suggest the majority of people believe there is a God. I am not wanting to be judgmental, but I sense a large part of that majority don’t necessarily pursue a daily close relationship with God. I am not saying they don’t score higher on the moral scale than me, though I typically have daily silent conversations with God. I just am convinced an ongoing relationship with God can make us a better person and nation.   

Claims made about God keep some from pursuing God 

Many of us are into God but many of us left the institutional church because claims about God’s character was contrary to our deepest moral intuitions. Why believe in a God you can’t respect. It is only intuitive that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. Beliefs about God’s love that don’t match how you know you ought to love your neighbor may be amiss. Don’t believe everything you hear about God! See here.

Hidden agenda in relationships keep some from pursuing God

Conversations with God followers often feels like them trying to change your beliefs. That can stifle exploration. I hate to admit I use to have an agenda with those outside the institutional church. I was taught God’s good news was saving people from Hell so they could get into Heaven. I was wrong according to Jesus. See here.   The ship may have sailed others trusting us to have open conversations. All I know to do is to focus on a life where actions speak louder than words in case others want to pursue God. 

Some don’t want to give up stuff or change

I suppose many may believe there is a God but don’t pursue because it would may require they consider changing some habits. If you know what you are doing is harming others and you don’t care, that is on you. But if struggling with habits that you know are hurting you and others, God doesn’t have a list for you to conquer before getting to know God.

Bible, church, prayer, etc.

Christians may suggest if you aren’t reading your Bible, going to church, praying daily, etc. that you can’t be close to God. Don’t buy it. If the Bible isn’t fun to read or leading to positive changes, put it on the shelf. If interested read blogs or books that get you thinking about God.  Not interested in attending the institutional church for whatever reason. Okay! See if can find relationships that share your beliefs through other means. It isn’t easy but worth a try. God doesn’t have a list of traditions to adhere to. God is willing to have a relationship on your terms.

Other reasons to not pursue God

I wrote on this topic a few months ago. See here  I suggested additional challenges to pursuing God more intently:  

  • Maybe because you can’t reconcile why God doesn’t intervene more with evil and suffering in the world
  • Maybe because of some trauma in your life
  • Maybe because God-followers as a group are poor role models

Do you want to think more about God daily? 

Find something that works for you – reading, writing, a brief prayer daily, whatever. Discover what works for you that gets you more on the path you want to be. I am a better person than I would be because of God’s influence in my life. I don’t always return anger with anger, sometimes I forgive when asked, sometimes I hold doors, or go the extra mile to be nice. Don’t believe everything others claim about God. I am convinced seeking God’s help in loving others is a life worth living.

Why Do Many Believe In God But Don’t Pursue A Close Relationship?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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by Michael Donahoe

Why is it many of us who call ourselves Christians spend more time defending our beliefs rather than enjoying time spent with others? Often, we do it not only to non-believers, but even to our brothers and sisters in Christ.

We know how Jesus lived; he loved others, accepted those who the religious crowd did not like, he was kind, loving, forgiving and caring to all he came in contact. It seems the only people who he had a problem with were religious self-righteous leaders. Yet, we see many of those who claim to follow Jesus go out and argue with those who interpret the Bible differently, or who do not believe the same or live the same.

It seems to me rather than fight and argue over doctrine, interpretation and belief we would do better to love, accept and show compassion. After all, Jesus said to love God and love one another. He never said judge and condemn others or avoid those who think differently.

This certainly does not mean we have to agree with everyone, but we do not have to fight and defend our way of thinking. Many of us think we have it all figured out and our way of faith is the only way. We think we have to persuade others to come to our way of thinking or they are doomed to hell.

I am not sure any of us have it all figured out, in fact I know none of us do. We all have room to question, learn and change. I know my wife and I are doing more questioning than we ever did, and we are finding new truths as we walk in the Spirit daily.

When it comes down to it, I feel we should be open to accept others no matter what their way of thinking. People want to be loved and accepted, they want to be happy and get along with others. When we get all religious and defend our point of view, it does more harm and drives people apart more than anything.

As followers of Jesus, we should be seeking strength to accept and love everyone. No matter what they believe, what their faith or doctrine is, no matter their religion, nationality, sexual preference or color, we want to see them as Jesus sees them. This type of love comes from the Spirit of God who is within us.

Naturally, people will not always agree, but we want to look past those areas of disagreement and find the commonalities we have and share the love of God together. This does not happen by condemning and bashing people nor by trying to prove we are right and they are wrong.

Love does not mean seeing eye-to-eye, it does not mean we agree or even like some of the things people do, but it does mean we look past the differences and love them as Christ loves them. Let’s look past the labels and see people who have feelings, who want love and friendship, people we can get to know, learn from, share thoughts and ideas with, and accept as fellow human beings who are created in the image of God.

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Michael Donahoe was added as a writer as his views fit perfectly with those of Done with Religion. He also writes on Substack at https://myopinionblog.substack.com/

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by Michael Donahoe

As I was thinking about the terrible tragedy recently at Club Q, and the similar tragedy a few years ago at the Pulse Nigh Club, I wondered why such horrible treatment is directed toward those who are LGBTQ.

They are people who just want to be themselves, to be accepted, live a good life, find love and be successful. To me, that sure sounds like every other person in the world. Yet, because they find love or express their sexuality in different ways than others, they are targeted for hateful treatment. That is so sad, so wrong and so unChrist-like.

Unfortunately, such horrible treatment will only continue if hate speech continues from some of our political leaders, from some of our Christian leaders and if Christian Nationalism gets more power. What gets me the most is the hateful speech and treatment that comes from many who claim to follow Jesus. Christians are supposed to be known for their love of God and love of people. We do not always agree, but Jesus said to love one another. He never said to judge, condemn and treat others as less-than or as second-class citizens.

I do not understand why people will go to the extremes of hatred and exclusion against those who are LGBTQ. Even if you disagree or do not understand, why is it that you cannot be loving and kind toward fellow human beings?

If you choose to believe that being LGBTQ is a sin, that is your choice. But, even with that particular belief it gives no one the right to judge, condemn and hate them.

I personally believe that the few verses in the Bible that refer to this subject are often misunderstood. They may have been misinterpreted over the years by the men who were doing the translating due to the differences in the times and customs when the Bible was written, along with the many changes in words and meanings over the years. Of course, this does not necessarily mean the translations of the Bible are wrong, but there are certainly other views and interpretations that should be looked at before making up your mind on what is correct. I have read several books that shed light on some other interpretations of these questionable verses and I think it is a good idea to think about these views to help understand what the writers may have meant. The books referred to are listed for further study:

Clobber the Passages: Seven Deadly Verses by Mel White

UnClobber: Rethinking Our Misuse of the Bible on Homosexuality by Colby Martin

Torn: Rescuing the Gospel from the Gays-vs.-Christians Debate by Justin Lee

God and the Gay Christian: The Biblical Case in Support of Same-Sex Relationships by Matthew Vines

Is God A Gay Basher?: Memoirs of a Christian, gay affirming Lesbian by Jan Liebegott

The Children Are Free: Reexamining the Biblical Evidence on Same-sex Relationships by Jeff Miner

I also look at the example of Jesus and how he loved and accepted people, especially those the religious leaders condemned. Jesus did not tell us to judge and condemn people, but he said to love one another.

I believe those who are LGBTQ are normal human beings who were created by and loved by God and just want to live their lives like everyone else. Just like any other human being, whether you agree or not, we all deserve equal rights and to be treated with love and respect.

I will end with a link to an article I came across by Mark Sandlin which gives a few things to think about when it comes to treating those who are LGBTQ in a kind and loving way:


Michael Donahoe was added as a writer as his views fit perfectly with those of Done with Religion. He also writes on Substack at https://myopinionblog.substack.com/

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