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Posts Tagged ‘acceptance’

Should Christians Try To Convince Others About God?

Posted in Acceptance, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , on May 19, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

I experience God being such an encourager in helping me to be more the person I desire to be deep down. If you are inclined to believe in God and you don’t feel God’s encouragement, it may be your views of God. See here. Christians often feel an obligation to share God with others because being taught God’s message was believe or go to Hell. Was that how Jesus interacted with others?

How did Jesus interact with others?

Many, including me, are convinced to understand Jesus is to understand God. Jesus encouraged his twelve disciples simply to follow Him. They didn’t all believe right away until Jesus proved himself. Jesus told the woman who had committed adultery: “go now, and leave your life of sin” (John 8). Where was Jesus’ evangelical spiel to avoid Hell? Jesus was asked by a religious expert how to have eternal life. He simply said to love God and your neighbor (Lk.10:25-37). I have a hunch Jesus thought loving God would lead to loving others. Jesus’ example and message wasn’t about escaping Hell but avoiding the destructive consequences of sin in this life. God can help in such a journey.   

How has God acted in convincing others? 

I suspect God is a respecter of one choosing their beliefs. Evil in the world clearly reveals God doesn’t force compliance, or there wouldn’t be so much horrific evil in this world. God obviously understands what we humans know – freedom is necessary for authenticity. Not even God can force true love. If you are thinking God eventually “gets you” in the afterlife by sending unbelievers to Hell, I doubt it.  See here.  

Christians must avoid the “agenda” reputation

Conversations with God-followers often feels like them trying to change your beliefs. We all hate when our partner doesn’t listen and just wants to give advice. One reason many avoid spiritual discussions is because they can smell a hidden agenda a mile away. It’s wrong to engage in friendships with others for the purpose of converting them to believe as you do, without advising upfront your agenda. Christians must avoid the appearance of having a hidden agenda. Conversations need to be natural and mutual.

How can Christians represent or share God?

God may not speak to us demonstratively out of love. Just because earthly parents sometime know and advise what is best for their older child, such advice doesn’t always work out. In fact, overzealousness can lead to a child feeling controlled, thus rejecting what is best for one’s own good. We must be considerate in our discussions about God with others. The road traveled of learning, reflecting, and not being pressured can lead to lasting convictions and more meaningful human and spiritual relationships. We don’t have to feel guilty because we aren’t convincing others about God and their love for them. Most Christians believe God has influential power. God believers can relax and simply share their personal experience if an opportunity naturally arises!

Should Christians Try To Convince Others About God?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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How Do We Pursue “Truth” That Will Heal A Nation?

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Jesus follower, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , , , , , , on April 28, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

Claiming Truth falsely can be destructive. Many Christian leader claim that we as a people and nation must rely on biblical truth. Can we always know what biblical truth is? Attempts have been made to censor mis-informers in the public arena. Can we always know what misinformation is concerning science or political policies? We must be careful what we claim as Truth and how we interact with others during uncertainty.

What is scientific or biblical truth? 

The bedrock of science use to be considering hypotheses to explain a phenomenon in the natural world. It is an educated guess based on the information we have currently have and could change if we get new information in the future. Drugs are often approved initially, only to be pulled from the shelves later after causing death. The truth is that it isn’t science if there isn’t debate!

Ancient literature subject to interpretation cannot be the definitive word on truth. Besides, even if all agreed that the Bible correctly interpreted confirms God condemns gays or forbids women in leadership in religious institutes, we cannot prove that the writers always portrayed God accurately. Any biblical truth claimed must also agree with natural truth such as sexual abuse is evil; otherwise, we must purse truth with an open mind.

Are there self-evident truths we can agree on?

No, one can’t just follow their own heart! What reasonable or rational person doesn’t expect the golden rule from others in their own relationships. Our inborn sense of good and evil, not an ancient Book, tells us sexual abuse or murder is immoral. Most criminals don’t defend their murders or thefts; instead, they deny committing such crimes. We don’t debate many laws, only what is a just punishment. It is a dictatorship not a democracy when we impose our will on issues such as pandemic responses, taxes, climate change, immigration, etc. Dictatorships don’t end well. Benefits and risks exist for most issues.

Freedom of speech is critical 

Denying free expression of belief is playing Superior in the lives of others. God is the example for God-believers. God has respected freedom of beliefs from the very beginning; otherwise, God who is powerful enough to create would annihilate immediately those who oppose God by choosing evil. Freedom is necessary for authenticity, the highest good in relationships, or we could accuse God of not creating the “best” world. A true debate of differing opinions, regardless if you think one is a heretic or conspiracist, is our best chance at arriving at the most caring decision for all concerned. Until we all ask ourselves “am I acting toward others like I want to be treated,” we are destined to fail. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t confront those who reject freedom of speech! 

Uncertainty can be a good thing 

Certainty rather than uncertainty comforts individuals psychologically. One may believe the seemingly certain narrative because unknowing can create anxiety. When only one side is presented, control and power grow intentionally or unintentionally. It should be intuitive denying diverse opinions is unloving and controlling. Couples who act as if they are always right and their partner is wrong are headed toward divorce. Having good intentions by believing you are right for the whole doesn’t matter when certainty isn’t universal. God-followers and religious leaders seem hell-bent in telling people what they must believe about God according to their understanding and interpretation of the Bible. Politicians seem hell-bent in claiming certainty regarding policies such as climate change and immigration, though there are arguments on both sides. 

Should we avoid those who claim certainty and don’t pursue truth civilly?

One has every right to question when one claims certainty regarding non-self-evident truths. Even evil people don’t think others can violate their rights in ways that they violate others. A refusal to openly discuss or defend one’s views suggest an unhealthy dependency on “certainty.” If someone makes false claims of those who oppose them such as calling them racists, without being able to give specific examples, are they really interested in pursuing truth? How about “they have a different opinion!”

What are necessary paths to pursing truth? 

There are truths which almost has universal agreement. Do you know one person who denies adultery is wrong except the betrayer?

  • Shouldn’t Christian leaders quit always claiming their biblical interpretation is correct and at least acknowledge literature requires interpretation “according to their understanding?”
  • Shouldn’t we examine all Books about religion to discern what seems the most universally true? What are Christians afraid of if they have the truth?
  • Shouldn’t we listen to everyone’s opinion and seek to discern together what is the most loving action according to the circumstances?
  • Shouldn’t we first stop claiming our views are morally superior to those we disagree with unless speaking of universal accepted moral truths
  • Shouldn’t we can begin conversations by looking for areas we agree?
  • Shouldn’t we discuss differences by defending our reasoning, respecting the opinions of others, and commit to growing in understanding
  • Shouldn’t we stop labeling those who disagree with our biblical interpretations as heretics?
  • Shouldn’t we can stop calling those who disagree with our views of science as conspiracists?

Open-minded uncertainty, rather than supposed certainty, could go a long way to healing our nation and personal relationships. Imagine how different as a people we would be if religious and political folks had open discussions what are the most caring actions for the greater good concerning non-universal matters such as immigration or climate policies. Most religions agree the overriding moral guide is to love others like you want to be treated. Belief or lack of belief in God doesn’t give you an excuse to not treat others like you want to be treated.

How Do We Pursue Truth That Will Heal A Nation?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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So Many Divisions within the church

Posted in Acceptance, christian living, institutional church, Jesus follower, religion, The church, tagged , , , , , , , , on April 3, 2024|

by Jim Gordon

It is sad that Christianity is divided into so many different groups. We all have a little different interpretation of the Bible and a little different understanding of doctrine. Obviously, we are not going to agree on everything, but we certainly should be able to love one another and accept each other even when we differ on these things.

It is hard to understand why there are so many divisions when God tells us we are to be one, as Jesus and God are one. Yet, we understand that we are human and it is easy to lose sight of our first love. If we could only stay focused on Christ, listening for his voice and the guidance of the Spirit, loving God and loving others as God intended, then we could begin to look past our differences.

The problem seems to be that we are unwilling to see any other viewpoint other than our own. There are those such as my wife and I that do not attend an organized church. There are those who attend a church every time the doors are open. Some attend a house church, some meet with fellow believers at cafe’s, parks or restaurants, and others meet in their homes over dinner. We should accept these differences and love one another rather than argue over who is right and who is wrong.

There really is not a right or wrong way to assemble together and we need to stop expecting everyone to do things exactly the same way. We should respect the viewpoints of others and focus on loving them rather than expecting them to see things our way.

Things will not change until we start focusing on what is common in our lives rather than the differences. The common focus should be on Christ, the head of the body. After that, we should focus on loving others rather than arguing about the differences in interpretation.

We should also keep in mind that we are all constantly changing as God brings new truth to us. We are all learning and changing as we are ready to accept new truths. The interpretations I had five years ago are completely different from some of the interpretations I have now. I am sure in another five years they will change again as God leads me into more truth.

Sometimes we are afraid to accept the opinions and interpretations of those who are outside of our belief system because we feel if we do not hold to our way of thinking, we are compromising and not standing up for what we believe. We do not have to give up how we interpret the Bible, but neither should we think everyone else is wrong. Besides, we really are not responsible for leading others into our truth, or convicting them of sin, or even saving them. That is the job of the Holy Spirit. We are told to love God and love others.

When we realize we are each equally important functioning parts of the body, and Christ is the head, we can start to change how we feel about those who do not see things exactly the way we do. We can begin to accept our brothers and sisters in Christ as they are, as we realize we are walking as one with the purpose of sharing the love of God.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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We Are Called to Love

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , on March 21, 2024|

by Jim Gordon

Jesus told us in the New Covenant to love God with all our heart, soul, strength and mind, and to love others as ourselves. So why is there so much disagreement and arguing over matters that none of us really have any control over?

Even Christians cannot seem to get along. There are so many different denominations and groups, all because we cannot agree on our doctrines and interpretations of the Bible.

I think we are all, Christians and non-Christians alike, people of some kind of faith. We all have faith in something. The thing is, we fight and argue over our faith and beliefs, yet none of us can prove our faith one way or another.

We get mad at each other because we have different views. We separate ourselves and think less of each other, yet we cannot prove what we believe. We will condemn and convict others, yet there is always the chance that what we believe may be wrong.

Why is it that we cannot just accept one another. We can have our beliefs, interpretations and ideas yet not force them on others. We should not expect everyone to believe just like we do. We are constantly learning as light is shed on new truths over time as we are ready for them.

Rather than fight and argue over what we believe and try to force our beliefs on others, why can’t we love one another just like God asked? Why can’t we just love God and others and accept them for who they are, where they are and leave the rest to God.

Rather than look at people of this world according to what they believe, and who or what they have faith in, I think to be more like Jesus we should be loving and accepting of them just the way they are. This is not to say everyone can live the way they want without consequences. It is not to say everyone will come to God in their own way, that all roads lead to God. Christ came for the purpose of restoring fellowship between people and God. It is by grace, provided by Christ, that we come to God.

Reading about the life of Christ, we see a man who loved people. A man who accepted people for who they were. He did not condemn them nor did he separate himself from those who were different. Jesus loved them. To be Christ-like in our world today, I think we should do the same.

No matter what we believe, what our faith is in, what interpretation we have, none of us can prove a thing. None of us has any control over it. It is all in God’s hands. So why spend so much time fighting and arguing. Let’s allow the love of Christ to flow out of us to touch a world that is so desperate for true love and acceptance. Let’s remember that everyone is entitled to their opinion and view on faith. Whether we all agree on God or not, we can agree to treat one another with kindness, respect and in a loving way.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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9 Reasons To Not Trust The Bible’s Claims About God!

Posted in Acceptance, Bible, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , on March 17, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

You may not notice some of the vilest claims in the Bible about God until you begin reading very closely. Leaders tout that God inspired/approved all written in the Bible, yet some actions contributed to God by the writers make no moral sense. Unfortunately, newcomers will be directed to read the Bible and be horrified reading about some of God’s supposed actions. Rationalizations are given to explain such actions about God to protect God’s inspiration of the Bible (writers understood God perfectly). I suggest instead considering if biblical writers always understood God correctly. Do the following passages really describe a loving God? There are hundreds. I will conclude by suggesting how to read the Bible without being revolted. 

Contradictions in the Bible

Contradictions are one reason to doubt God’s inspiration/oversight of the Bible. If God can raise the dead, God can obviously control transmissions of words supposedly given to the biblical writers – but God didn’t! The list of contradictions may be trivial but are sizable (See Gregory Boyd, Inspired Imperfection, Chapter 1):

  • II Sam 24:1 says God incited David to sin; I Chr 21:1 blames it on Satan
  • 2 Kgs 24:6 says Jehoiakim had a son; Jer 36:30 says Jehoiakim didn’t have a son to reign after him
  • Does God take pleasure in destroying (Deut. 28:63), or does God take no pleasure in the death of the wicked (Ezek. 33:11)?
  • Does God punish children for the sins of parents (Ex. 34:7; Num. 14:18), or does God never punish children for what parents do (Ezek. 18:20)?
  • Matthew says Jeremiah rather than Zechariah spoke about the thirty pieces of silver (Mt 27:9-10. Zech 11:12-13)
  • Did Jesus say the rooster would crow once after Peter’s three denials (Mt 26.34, Lk 22:34, John 13:38), or did the rooster crow twice (Mk 14:30)

Moral challenges concerning God’s character are much more disconcerting. I will cite only a few below that advocate violence or immoral actions in God’s name.

God supposedly kills an entire human race by drowning

“Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; human beings and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark.” (Gen 7:23)

Keep in mind Genesis talks about a magical tree of good and evil and talking snakes. A Global Flood could be a literary device to illustrate the destructiveness of human versus God’s ways. Maybe the writers used an analogy of a Flood and drowning because their world view including God controlling the natural world. I might not read the Flood story to young children but wait to explain that God didn’t really drown practically the entire human race. Personally, I wouldn’t use a drowning analogy to portray God’s character. Not sure God would either!

God supposedly mandated death for cursing, gathering sticks, etc.

When it comes to many of the laws, the OT claims God spoke these words (Exodus 20:1). Biblical writers rarely claimed audible God-speak. “God said” recorded hundreds of times in the Bible is most likely a figure of speech expressing inner impressions or understandings about God – right or wrong. How can we be sure the writers heard inner God’s voice correctly?

  • Did God really mandate whoever curses their parents be put to death (Ex. 21:17)?
  • Did God really mandate to death a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath (Num 15:32-36)?
  • Did God really require death for adultery (Lev 20:10)? That’s a lot of bodies today
  • Did God really command whoever does work on the Sabbath be put to death (Ex 31:15)?
  • Did God really command death for those who blaspheme the name of the Lord (Lev 24:16)?

God supposedly approved a wife’s hand being cut off when grabbing a man’s genitals

“If two men are fighting and the wife….reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.” (Deut 25:11-12) 

A woman raped is forced to marry her rapist

“If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered…..He must marry the young women, for he has violated her.” (Deut 22:28-29)

Women were seen as property of the father or husband and she was no longer valuable (being a virgin) after being raped! Did God really approve a woman being required to marry her rapist as if this was a step up to protecting victims from a life of shun? 

God supposedly orders killing boys and non-virgins but sparing virgins for the warriors 

“Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.” (Num 31:17-18) 

Did God really stay silent because the Israelites couldn’t handle the truth that requiring a woman to marry soldiers who killed their children and husband is evil? Sounds like men writers imagining God talking to them! 

God supposedly commanded genocide – all men, women, children, infants, and animals

“This is why the Lord Almighty says….Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them: put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.” (I Sam 15:2-3) 

“Twelve thousand men and women fell that day – all the people of Ai. For Joshua did not draw back the hand that held out his javelin until he had destroyed all who lived in Ai. But Israel did carry off for themselves the livestock and plunder of this city, as the Lord had instructed Joshua.” (Joshua 8:25-27). See also Joshua 10:28.

If you don’t think this is morally repulsive, how would you react if you read these same commands in the Koran? 

A daughter is given as a reward for being victorious in Battle 

And Caleb said “I will give my daughter Aksah in marriage to the man who attacks and captures Kiriath Sepher.” (Josh 15:16)

Just in verse 13 the Lord was supposedly giving commands to Caleb. It is reasonable to think the writer assumed approval by God giving the daughter away. Why didn’t the writer at least mention God’s outcry to stop treating women as possessions and property. That is wrong regardless of culture norms as were civil right violations in America decades ago. I bet God was speaking up, but men in biblical times just weren’t listening as many Americans too in the past.

God will slay with thirst, have sex in public to shame, and then speak to her tenderly 

See Hosea 2: 1-14. I imagine this story was to illustrate Israel’s unfaithfulness to God, rather than God literally telling Hosea to marry a promiscuous woman. I doubt though God wanted to be portrayed slaying with thirst (v. 2), possibly have sex in public to shame her (v.10), and then act as if God can then start talking tenderly (v.14). I can think of better illustrations to portray a loving God. I got a hunch the writers were portraying how they perceived God.

God supposedly is arbitrary with justice

God kills Uzzah for putting his hand out to balance the Ark from falling (II Sam 6:7), yet God is silent when David committed adultery and had Bathsheba’s husband killed. (2 Sam 11:14) Even in the New Testament God supposedly struck dead Ananias and Sapphira for lying how much money they donated to the church (Acts 5). Then, God is said to kill some for celebrating Communion without examining their heart. (I Cor.11:30). I would be dead!

How can we know God if not through the Bible 

Despite contradictions and moral challenges, many hold on to an inspired Bible for fear the Bible will be discarded for “whatever goes” in understanding God. A Book subject to interpretation cannot be the definitive word of what God is truly like. Biblical scholars interpret differently the same passages, and most of us don’t acknowledge our interpretation could be wrong. The challenge is many interpret their inspired Book as God being violent or advocating violence. This has led to imitating or justifying violence in the name of a perfect loving God.

Few believe God dictated the writers’ recordings. You certainly can’t prove God controlled the writers’ thoughts to always understand God perfectly. As mentioned “God said” is recorded hundreds of times in the Bible. This is likely a figure of speech expressing inner impressions or understandings about God written down – right or wrong. We can’t prove the writers understood God perfectly other than taking their word by claiming they are inspired by God (2 Tim 3:16-17). That is circular reasoning. We were surely created to love the way the Creator loves. It isn’t presumptuous to imagine what a loving God is like though our moral consciences. See here.

Why should I bother to read the Bible?   

The Bible is God’s story beginning with Israel and culminating with the life of Jesus that we don’t possess in other documents. God may have inspired/encouraged the writers to write but didn’t necessarily approve of everything written about God. When reading the Bible, contemplate what a loving God is really like. Enjoy what God is trying to reveal to you about your Creator and how to treat others. Imagine if extremists had to consider that God didn’t inspire every word in their Book and had to openly discuss what a loving God is like. Interpretations about God’s love toward others, that don’t match how you and most know you ought to love your neighbor, may be amiss. A Book must not replace our relationship with God and common moral sense. Questioning the Bible may lead to knowing God better!

9 Reasons To Not Trust The Bible’s Claims About God!

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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Why Do We Avoid Discussing Our Different Beliefs With Others?

Posted in Acceptance, christian living, Love of God, religion, tagged , , , , , , on March 3, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

Politics/science has joined organized religion in possessing an unfortunate quality. Spiritual and political discussions are important as they help guide our values as individuals or as a nation. Science discussions are important as health decisions are made such as responding to Covid. Freedom of personal beliefs is trampled upon by denying open debate. The truth is certainty doesn’t always exist. Climate debates are critical to decide the greatest human flourishing. Christian leaders claim God and the Bible condemns gays without acknowledging contrary biblical interpretations. We must recognize our fears that lead to denying or avoiding discussions. 

There are universal certainties not subject to debate 

No rational person argues that physical or sexual abuse is up for debate. Moral truths are not determined by a Book, popular opinion, or by a few in power. We all have an inborn sense of good and evil. Concerning non-universal matters such as immigration policies, we must have open discussions which laws are the most caring for the greater good. Most religions agree the overriding moral guide is to love others like you want to be loved. Belief or lack of belief in God doesn’t give you an excuse to not treat others like you want to be treated.

We fear consequences for sharing our beliefs

We may avoid discussions because we don’t have to take action if we don’t bother to consider believing differently. Being treated unjustly though may be a bigger fear. Both Republicans and Democrats in the past have denied the results of elections. You decide if there has been equal justice in this arena recently. Disagreeing with the perceived popular science narrative or disagreeing with church leadership about God’s character can lead to isolation or being blacklisted. Thriving societies must support individuals being allowed to form their own opinions without threats when universal agreement isn’t obvious. Why is one afraid to defend their view, if they know the “truth”?

We fear not fitting in

Groupthink is just human nature. Most humans desire to integrate with a group, get along with its members, and benefit from them. Discussing opposing beliefs can be uncomfortable. The loner must fend for himself. It’s extremely difficult to acquire or achieve anything all by oneself. If you leave your group, your options are limited to joining the opposing group or being alone. For most of us, neither option is appealing. Being your own person is a tough business.

We fear loss of security

Threats of losing your job are undeniable due to the assault on freedom of one’s opinion. One may not oppose censoring activities for fear losing their livelihood because they disagree with the popular, uncertain narrative. In politics differing with the popular opinion might not lead to reelection. Pastors risk being kicked out of the pulpit. It is a human right to disagree if one is not inciting physical violence toward others. I am convinced racism is evil (that blacks are an inferior race), but I must debate those who are free to disagree. I will win the debate!

Fear of liability 

Many pushed for mandates for the Covid Shots because they believe in what authorities were telling them. The claim that the Shots stopped infection and transmission turned out to be false. It is understandable to believe authority figures are telling you the truth initially, but there is no excuse for continuing to deny evidences that has come forth. Worse, if one knew the truth from the beginning and yet still pushed a lie, they rightly should fear liability and be held accountable. We seem to have lost sight that it isn’t real science if there isn’t debate – science is ever evolving.

Fear of loss of power and control

Unfortunately, many fear not only losing their job but losing control and power. It doesn’t matter if you think you are right and doing what is best for the good of the land. Certainty is an illusion unless talking about universal evil such as rape or incest. Try claiming certainty in your personal relationships. If married you are probably headed toward divorce. Individuals must have the freedom to decide what is the best decision for themselves, or the powerful rule the powerless. Individual freedom is a higher principle than lording over others what you “think” is right. You may be wrong! Control and power flourish when others are not allowed to discuss alternative opinions. One way to judge one’s motive is to demand answers for refusing to debate. If one is sure they are right for the good of all, why fear convincing others in the public arena?

Fear of uncertainty

Certainty rather than uncertainty is more comforting psychologically. One may believe what seems to be the popular narrative because unknowing can lead to anxiety. One can avoid anxiety by not discussing their beliefs with others who believe differently. For one to question a main belief they have been taught in church all their life, such as if Hell is real, can create anxiety about what other beliefs may be questionable. Also, uncertainty is often viewed as doubting, which is frowned upon in Christian circles. Similarly, questioning the uncertainty if the Covid shots are safe and effective, if we have gotten the shots, can raised anxiety and fear about our health.

We fear lack of civility

Disagreements are normal in relationships. We must talk to others like we want to be talked to. We must control our emotions. We can’t have discussions with those who are rude or close-minded. We can’t always prove what we believe is true about God. We can’t claim without debate if our climate control measures are best for the most human flourishing. We all must discuss differences calmly, accepting that misinformation isn’t opinions that don’t agree with your own. 

Imagine a world….

  • If we were open to defending our beliefs civilly
  • If we closely guarded one’s freedom to choose when the possibility exist you could be wrong
  • If we stopped calling those who disagreed with us heretics or conspiracists
  • If politicians encouraged open discussions to better discern together the greatest good for all
  • If Christians didn’t always claim their biblical interpretation is correct

When one does not respect your individual freedom to believe as you think best, there can be no discussion. Anyone who threatens to end a relationship because of a difference of opinion is not worthy of your friendship. Confrontation must sometimes take place with friends for one’s silence can be harmful to others; politicians must be voted out; one may have to discover new places for spiritual growth besides their current place of worship.

Why Do We Avoid Discussing Our Different Beliefs With Others?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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5 Lies About God Turn Many Away From God!

Posted in Acceptance, Bible, christian living, Love of God, religion, tagged , , , , , , , , , , on December 24, 2023|

By Mike Edwards

Lies may be too strong a word. I can’t prove with certainty what God’s views are regarding women’s roles, gays, etc. But it is only intuitive that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. All rational humans seem to have the same internal moral code – to love others like they want to be loved. The Bible can’t be the definitive word about God because scholars don’t all agree what the Bible claims about God on many moral issues. We also can’t prove God controlled prophets or writers to always understand God perfectly. We can imagine what a loving God is like though our moral consciences. See here.

God does not torture or kill infidels 

We know bad religion when we see it. Any religion that advocates or excuses those, who don’t accept their belief, being killed in this life is evil. Christianity must avoid having any comparisons with such a religion. A loving God can’t possible light infidels on fire and then not letting them die in the afterlife. Christians must reject such a view of Hell. Now, when one meets their Creator and rejects living a loving/godly life, I can see them being allowed to pass on into final death. I wrote that Hell (a place of forever punishment) is doubtful biblically and even morally from a loving God. See here.   See here.

God does not condemn gays for attractions they have no control over

How could a loving God possibly condemn gays when they can no more choose who they are attracted to than straights can? If you are a straight man, don’t you naturally have to fight not looking at naked women than men? Ask gays their battle! Who chooses to be gay when having to hide one’s sexuality because of bigotry and hostility? Even if you believe God inspired every word in the Bible and agrees with all written about God, not all biblical scholars interpret that Bible condemning monogamous gay relationships. See here. I am begging you to not condemn gays because the Bible supposedly does. Please be open to the possibility that you may be wrong.

God does not believe only men can serve certain roles 

Women suffer violence because some claim the Bible says God wants women submissive to men in ways men are not similarly submissive to women. It doesn’t matter all men don’t take a mile when given an inch. Enough do! Many women can obviously feel disrespected and confused why a supposedly loving God would choose according to gender than gifts in serving in the religious institutes. Men, walk in their shoes if you had certain leadership gifts. Most would agree it is immoral to favor one based on the color of their skin. Intuitively, to favor men over women for particular roles seems sexist. Scholars don’t agree how the Bible should be interpreted on roles for women in the home or church. See here.

God does not exclude infidels from Heaven after death 

One’s religion or rebellion against a certain religion is often based on the family born into whether it is Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, etc. Is God a God of chance? A loving God wouldn’t only let Christians into heaven when the majority of people born into this world died without knowledge of Jesus the Christ. No human or spiritual parent brings children into the world requiring that one’s eternal destination is based on circumstances out of one’s control. Only extremists believe you must adhere to a certain religion in this life or the life to come or be killed. Even the Bible possibly suggests all will eventually end up in Heaven. See here.

God can’t control evil or your suffering

One of the biggest reasons for being an atheist is because of the presence of evil in our world. Some suggest God doesn’t intervene in evil or suffering because all evil eventually leads to good, as if some grand plan by God. Tell that to sexual abuse victims or family members of murdered victims. We must consider that God can’t be all-powerful. Perfect love can’t be controlling. Ask any adult child. Evil and your suffering may be because God cannot intervene single-handedly without being controlling. Such freedom by God is necessary for authentic relationships to develop. Forced love is an oxymoron. God is surely doing all they can to stop suffering with the help of others. The alternative is that God can always stop your suffering and doesn’t, or that God arbitrarily stops other’s sufferings sometimes but not yours. I doubt it! 

How can we stop turning people away from God? 

I believe if we at least stopped claiming certainty in God’s name regarding gays, women’ roles in marriage or in church, or the destiny of those who don’t choose a certain religion in this life are destined to never be with God in the afterlife, we would have more open conversations and reveal more the loving God we believe in. Your interpretation may be wrong, so stay openminded. Christian leaders – show some courage and change your stance. You may not agree with my interpretations, but I will admit my interpretation could be wrong if you will. Don’t claim you have God all figured out according to a Book. Yes, we can claim God hates evil such as physical or sexual abuse, but for example listen to each gay’s story and love them like you would want to be loved if you had the same journey.

5 Lies About God Turn Many Away From God!

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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God is Like Jesus, Loving and Kind

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Jesus follower, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , on December 19, 2023|

by Jim Gordon

I grew up in the traditional church environment and followed the religious teachings and doctrines over the years. I have seen a lot of things that I now question and wonder why things were done that way.

Over the years many of us have come to see God as a big super human person sitting on a big throne up in heaven just waiting to punish us for our mistakes. We see God as being impersonal, judgmental and many times as someone to fear.

Yet when we think about the life of Christ and know he was sent from God to show us what God is really like we come to see God in a different way. When we read about how Jesus lived and treated people, we see him as loving, compassionate, kind and accepting. Jesus came to show us that God is the same way.

After Jesus left this life on earth God sent the Holy Spirit to live within us. Think about it, God in Spirit form lives within us and among us right now. God is not a super human person way up there somewhere but is Spirit and is right here within us.

God is not out to get us and punish us every time we mess up. I think God gets a bad reputation from some of the writings in the bible. I believe men, although they were inspired by God threw in some of their personal views. Obviously if you were inspired by someone to write a book you would still write it from your perspective. Anything man has a hand in is going to be flawed. The bible is inspired by God and when combined with the leading of the Holy Spirit is purposeful for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness, and in guiding us to the living Word of God who is Jesus.

Rather than running around being afraid of God and waiting for the judgment of God to fall, look at Jesus and see that God is love. Whenever correction is needed it is only for our good and it is done in love. Just as a loving parent sometimes corrects their child it is done in love and for the child’s own good. We are not waiting to be destroyed by a God who loves judgment and condemnation. We are living with a God who is love, who created us and who wants the best for us during our time on earth.

Stop being afraid of God and seek fellowship. If you hear a pastor telling you that God is out to get you and that you had better shape up or else, get away from there and find brothers and sisters in Christ who will be encouragers and who will help build you up rather than condemn and scare you. Fear of judgment will not lead you into a loving relationship with God. Only true, godly love will be what draws us into fellowship with God. God is love. For those of us who are followers of Jesus we should also be known for our love. As Jesus said in Matthew 22:37-39, And He said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ This is the great and foremost commandment. The second is like it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ Live a godly life by loving people. Rather than being known for judgment, condemnation, hatred and what you are against, show the love of God. Be kind to all people and be known for your love of your fellow human beings.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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What Is The Greatest Sin Of All? What All Religions Must Agree About God!

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, religion, tagged , , , , , , , on December 17, 2023|

By Mike Edwards

Okay! Murder, physical or sexual abuse, torture, etc. are horrific. But there is another deadly relationship killer that may not be as obvious. I am not fond of the word sin. God obviously hates evil when one has no regrets harming others, but God hates the sin more than the sinner. I doubt God disgustingly refer to us as sinners under their breathe when we regret our actions, when we struggle to change habitual patterns that are not in our best interest. Hardly a day doesn’t go by that I don’t live up to the standard I have set for myself. God only desires what we know we ought to desire for ourselves and others. God simply wants to come along aside to support and encourage.

The greatest sin may be not treating others like you want to be treated 

Previously, I wrote that God’s greatest desire is for us to treat others like we want to be treated. See here.  Jesus was asked what was the most important law by a religious-type (Mark 12:28-34). Religion-keepers try to stay in power by declaring all their rules are God’s rules. Jesus simply said to love God and love others as yourself. Jesus wasn’t claiming God was egotistical, only that loving God is the same as loving others like you want to be loved. Jesus wasn’t saying what hoops to jump through to be loved by God. Jesus was encouraging a lifestyle to pursue with God’s help. 

The sin of certainty may be the greatest way we fail living by the golden rule 

We are all tempted to insist we are right and the other side if wrong. Couples acting this way are headed toward divorce. God-followers and religious leaders seem hell-bent in telling people what they must believe about God according to their understanding and interpretation of the Bible. Politicians seem hell-bent in claiming certainty regarding policies such as climate change and immigration, though there are reasonable arguments on both sides of the aisle. Open-minded uncertainty, rather than supposed certainty, could go a long way to healing our nation and personal relationships. Stop condemning gays or insisting on certain women roles/dress according to your understanding. Imagine if you were gay or a woman and ask how you would want to be treated!

Why are people so damn certain? 

  • Christians often claim those who support gay marriages are heretics. They claim their truth because the Bible says so. They fail to understand ancient literature is subject to interpretations and biblical scholars don’t agree that God condemns gays. See here.
  • Why do politicians claim certainty other than to gain votes? Covid shots were mandated though there were disagreements in the beginning that the Shots prevented infection and transmission. They didn’t! Politicians may claim certainty to avoid arguing their “truth” to convince others
  • Individuals fall in love with certainty. If certain beliefs about God are challenged, what other beliefs they were taught could be wrong? Uncertainty can increase anxiety, but certainty leads to forcing “supposed” truths onto others. 

Uncertainty doesn’t result in lawlessness 

Who doesn’t believe rape is wrong unless a terrorist? Of course, terrorists who rape believe their partner shouldn’t be raped. It is often said we best know God according to “biblical truths.” The truth is contrary biblical interpretations exist for many moral issues. See here. I don’t know any reasonable God or non-God person that doesn’t respect the golden rule in relationships. Certain laws are just common, moral sense. Who doesn’t believe physical or sexual abuse is wrong? Different opinions, such as immigration or climate matters expressed without physical or verbal aggression, can stand side by side as we continually evaluate the most loving approach. Open discussions can steer us away from demanding “supposed truths.”

Changing for the future 

  • We must first stop claiming our views are morally superior to those we disagree with unless speaking of universal accepted moral truths
  • We must handle differences with physical and emotional civility
  • We can begin conversations by looking for areas we agree
  • We can discuss differences by defending our reasoning, respecting the opinions of others, and commit to growing in understanding
  • In a democratic society, which is better than the rule of those in power, the vote of the majority must be followed until voted on again 

What Is The Greatest Sin Of All? What All Religions Must Agree About God!

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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What Christianity Must Avoid Having In Common With Bad Religions!

Posted in Acceptance of Others, Bible, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , , , , on December 10, 2023|

By Mike Edwards

I don’t desire to offend anyone’s Religion, only bad beliefs. In this post, I will compare the Muslim’s and Christian’s supposed inspired Book, the Quran or Bible. I am not suggesting all Muslims or Christians share the same interpretations of their Book, but enough of either faith believe their God respectively either condemns Jews or gays. A believer naturally shows devotion and obedience to God by imitating their understanding of God according to the Book they considered inspired by God.

The dangers in assuming a Book is inspired by one’s God 

The Quran and Bible seemingly make controversial statements describing what God is like. The Quran is interpreted by many Muslims that God condemns Jews, even suggesting they are the enemy. See here. The Bible is interpreted by many Christians that God condemns gays by suggesting they will not enter the kingdom of God either here on earth or in the afterlife (I Cor. 6:9). The danger isn’t what a Book might say, but whether one assumes everything written about God is inspired by God. One cannot prove prophets or writers always understood God perfectly. It isn’t presumptuous to imagine what a loving God is like through our moral consciences. See here.

Bad religions assume infidels must be killed according to their God 

Both Books are said to refer to those not of their faith as infidels who must be killed either in this life or the afterlife. Many Muslims interpret the Quran to advise Jews must believe in their God or be killed even in this life. I am not aware those of the Christian faith suggesting such aggressions toward infidels in this life. But many Christians believe those who don’t accept Jesus in this life will enter a fiery, torturous existence in the afterlife. I can see how one might see both threats sharing some commonalities.

Christians must reject Hell for this reason. A God who advocates lighting an infidel on fire and not even allowing it to burn out, either in this life or the life to come, is not a loving God. Christians should reject Hell for biblical and moral reasons. See here.  Christians should reject Hell to avoid any comparisons to any religion that argue for death to infidels in this life or the life to come. Now, when one meets their Creator and rejects living a loving/godly life, I can see them being allowed to pass on into final death. It is just as reasonable, if not more reasonable, to believe a loving God that is able to create will take forever, if necessary, to save everyone from themselves. See here.

What is good religion?

We are free to speculate what a loving God is like, as a Book that may not be inspired and is subject to interpretation cannot be the definitive word on God. It is only intuitive that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. God’s nature doesn’t allow giving up on infidels even after their last breath. Even imperfect human parents wouldn’t cut off a child who eventually accepts they must love others like they want to be loved. Go ahead and live like Hell while here on earth! Careful the regrets you, your family, and friends will feel at the end of your life. Careful that our character developed here on earth may make the change process longer and more painful in the life to come. All good religions have in common that we must strive to treat others like you want to be treated or you don’t have a God worth believing in!

What Christianity Must Avoid Having In Common With Bad Religions!

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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