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Posts Tagged ‘church’

by Jim Gordon

We know when the word church is used most of the time we are talking about the modern-day, organized religious organization that people attend on Saturday or Sunday. The traditional organized church with its many programs, leaders, pastors, rules and regulations.

People attend church for various reasons such as out of obligation, guilt, social purposes or because they have always gone to church. Yet, many people attend church because they love being around other believers, they love worship and they enjoy participating. The thing to remember is whether we go or not has nothing to do with being a follower of Jesus.

We forget that the Church is not a building or an institution but a community of people who love God and love one another. Whether in a church building or out of the organization, we are all one body with Christ as the head.

I think an issue today among many of us who have left the organized church is that we feel those who are still involved in church and those who think differently than us are wrong. Often times we even seem to be enemies. This is absolutely wrong and not the correct way of thinking.

Sometimes those of us outside of church start thinking we are further along in our walk with God than those who still attend church. This is a bad attitude to have. We should be loving and accepting of those who are our brothers and sisters in Christ no matter if they attend church or not. Just as those who faithfully attend church should not look down on those who have left the organized system, looking at them as if they are backsliders or have lost their faith. God will lead each of us by the Spirit in the way we are to live.

The important thing is our love for God and for one another. No matter what we do on Sunday mornings, whether we attend a church building or love God from outside the walls, our goal is to decrease to self, our desires and plans, and allow God to increase and love others through us.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

Our world seems so divided. Christians often label others heretics if they don’t believe there is a literal Hell or that God doesn’t condemns gays. Hardly a conversation starter. Science seems to have followed in Religion’s footsteps. Those who question if Covid shots are as safe and effective as claimed are labeled anti-vaxers, though they may have gotten the flu vaccine for years. In politics opponents are labeled a racist or conspiracist without proof. If you avoid discussions when others aren’t acting irrational, I would love to hear your thoughts as to why. My email is at the end.

Why Christians may suck at discussing differences

I will use myself as an example unfortunately. It’s not meant to be an excuse. I believed decades ago that God condemned gays though they could no more control their attractions than straights. I was wrong. See hereI used to believe God sent those who didn’t have the right kind of faith while here on earth to a fiery, torturous afterlife. I was wrong. See here.  I am convinced the only reason I believed as I did was because of my understanding of the Bible. How could I be devoted to God if I didn’t follow the Bible’s teachings? Christians may not listen to different beliefs because they assume their interpretation or a biblical writer’s understanding of God is right. Stay openminded!

How we discuss our opinions is important 

We often are busy thinking we are right and preparing our response than listening. There are obvious reasons to avoid discussions with certain people. It is difficult to talk to others if they don’t control their emotions or convey they are right and you are wrong. We can’t have discussions with those who are rude or close-minded. But disagreements are normal in relationships. We can’t always prove what we believe is true about God. We can’t claim without debate if Covid shots or all the childhood vaccines are as safe as claimed. We can’t claim without debate if our climate control measures are best for the most human flourishing. But there may be deeper reasons why we avoid discussions with those who have different beliefs.

Societal influences can discourage discussion

News or information outlets one listen’s to may only report one viewpoint for whatever reason and imply other views are conspiracy. It is best to be aware of both sides of a different belief to decide for yourself. Church leadership often imply contra views to their own are heresy. Threats of being excommunicated, censored by authorities, or losing your job are real. The solution is for all to be free to discussion opinions openly without threats. If you know the “truth,” why be afraid to defend your view!

Most humans desire to integrate with a group, get along with its members, and benefit from them. The loner must fend for themselves. Both disagreeing with the perceived popular science narrative or disagreeing with church leadership about God’s character can lead to isolation or being ostracized.  Being your own person is a tough business. Thriving societies must support individuals being allowed to form their own opinions when universal agreement isn’t obvious. Misinformation isn’t opinions that don’t agree with your own. You may end up being wrong!

The fear of uncertainty can discourage discussion

Certainty rather than uncertainty is more comforting psychologically. One may believe what seems to be the popular narrative because unknowing can create confusion or anxiety. One can avoid anxiety by not discussing their beliefs with others who believe differently. I imagine most Leaders prefer being seen as knowing (certain) than not knowing (uncertain). For one to question a main belief they have been taught in church all their life, such as if Hell is real, can create anxiety about what other beliefs may be in question. Questioning if the Covid shots are as safe and effective if we have gotten the shots, can raised anxiety about our health. What if we pushed others to get the shots and we end up wrong? There may be an easy out. We sometimes trust those in authority, but we may come to realize such trust was misplaced.

What are the consequences of avoiding uncertainty?

The science often changes with further investigation. Many religious beliefs are subject to interpretation of a Book. That is why there are thousands of denominations with their own creeds. Certainty, not uncertainty, can lead others astray if one is wrong. Also, when only one side is presented, control and power grow intentionally or unintentionally. It should be intuitive denying diverse opinions is unloving and controlling. Most don’t except such behaviors in their personal relationships. A refusal to openly discuss or defend one’s views is a denial of personal choice and suggests an unhealthy dependency on “certainty.” Relax! Universal truths exist. What religion denies the main thing – to love and treat others like you want to be treated.

There can be nefarious reasons for preventing discussions 

The most benign explanation for censoring the opinions of others is not necessarily the fear of losing power as much as the fear of losing security (one’s livelihood). In my counseling career, I often questioned the narrative concerning psychotropic medications. A client is owed a discussion of both the risks and benefits of such an intervention for mental healthiness. I didn’t always share my opinion with psychiatrists in charge. I don’t fear conflict. But I am sure I feared potential loss of a job because I was in the minority and low on the totem pole. In politics differing with the perceived popular opinion might not lead to reelection. Pastors risk being kicked out of the pulpit.

The more evil explanation for censoring the opinions of others is one’s desire for control and power over others. Control and power also have financial benefits. Control and power flourish when others are not allowed to discuss alternative opinions in the public arena. Many may fear liability if they admit they are wrong and participated in thwarting discussion. One way to judge one’s motive is by demanding answers as to why one is refusing debate. If you are so sure you are right, why do you fear convincing others? Religion and science are playing God (Superior) in the lives of others by claiming they know the truth and we are too stupid to decide for ourselves!

What is truth?

Openminded people accept they may be wrong. We are more likely to be right when there seems to be almost universal agreement on the topic of concern. Most don’t defend rape, or physical or sexual abuse. Adultery isn’t wrong only in the eyes of the betrayer. But rational people do not agree on matters such as immigration policies, climate policies, marijuana legalization, if God condemns gays, if God inspired all of the Bible, etc. We must be willing to defend our views among one another rather than shut down those we disagree with. Those fortunate enough to live in a democratic society must accept the vote of the majority when comes to law setting. You can still defend your position in hopes of a future vote. May the best, most common-sense position win.

Love surely is the path forward to healthy discussions and debates 

My co-blogger rightly suggest love is the path forward. See here. We can strive to be the better person in conversation. But we have every right to oppose those who refuse to accept uncertainty and fight fairly. This can be done civilly but lack of freedom of speech is important for future generations. Leaders must be held accountable to be open-minded than certain. In our personal lives, we can try to engage with those who insist on certainty when it doesn’t exist but in time one may need to move on. We can stop labeling those who disagree with our biblical interpretations as heretics. We can stop calling those who disagree with our views of science or politics as conspiracists. Imagine how different as a people we would be if religious, science, and political folks talked openly for the common goal of pursing the greater good!

Why Can’t We Discuss Our Political, Science, Or Religious Differences?

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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by Jim Gordon

Have you noticed how people like to look up toward the sky when they think of God? I recently watched several football players giving God praise by looking up and pointing toward the sky. Many of us who are Christians seem to think of God as being up in the sky somewhere looking down on us. We are taught in our churches that God is up there and someday we will go to be with God.

We tend to forget that the Kingdom of God is within us. We are told that we are the temple of the Holy Spirit and God resides within us. The sad fact is that we really do not act like we believe this truth.

If we could only get it in our head and down in our spirit that God is not somewhere up there, far away in heaven. God lives within us by the Spirit. We have the Spirit within us to teach and guide us. The bible says we have the mind of Christ.

We are living in the Kingdom of God right now. Yes, we are constrained by our human body, but our spirit is one with God’s Spirit and we are spiritually living with God in the Kingdom now.

It would be nice to begin hearing more about the presence of God within us right now. More often we hear about a God who is far away and who may show up from time to time to bless us if we attend the right meeting at the right place.

God is here now, living within us. God is with us each and every day walking with us in whatever we go through in our daily life. God loves us and is concerned about us and is there for our good. It can be a hard thing to get the old teachings of the church out of our heads and accept the fact that God lives within us now. It reminds me of the old saying ‘you can take the boy out of the country but you can’t take the country out of the boy’. In this case, you can take the boy out of religion but you can’t take religion out of the boy.

Religion is man’s way of making his way to God. Yet we find out that man cannot come to God by our efforts and good works. Grace is the only way man comes to God, and it is all by the grace of God through Jesus.

Once Jesus left this earth he sent us a comforter, the Spirit who now dwells within the people of God. The Church is not a religious organization and is not a building. The Church are the followers of Jesus whether they attend a physical church or not.

God lives within us. God’s home is within us and God is with us spiritually just as much now as when our earthly body passes away and we live in our glorified, spiritual bodies.

Start making the effort to see things as God says they are, not as we have been taught within religion. God is not up in the sky, God lives within us. We are the temple and each of us collectively form the kingdom body now.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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by Jim Gordon

If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone — Romans 12:18

To be at peace with all people, including believers and non-believers, it seems almost impossible in our world today. We have so many different thoughts and ideas, different denominations, interpretations and beliefs and all the different religions. It makes you wonder how it is possible to be at peace with everyone?

The dictionary describes peace as freedom from disquieting or oppressive thoughts or emotions; harmony in personal relations.

I have been thinking recently about how some Christian people act towards those who see things differently. I do not know why we can be so mean at times. We feel we have to prove our point to others and stand our ground when it comes to doctrine and interpretation of the bible. I am not sure why we feel it is our job to be the morality police. Why do we feel the need to force our views, beliefs and interpretations on others?

Rather than base our lives on following doctrine and interpretation, we are to follow the example of Jesus. He said to love God and love one another. There is no way to be at peace with others without loving them. We cannot love others without the Spirit of love living within us.

Often times when we meet new people, or even when we get together with current friends, if we could just see the person as a human being without any labels, knowing that God loves them, it is easier to be at peace with them. The problem often seems to be when conversations get onto the subject of politics or religion, things can get divisive. We quickly forget the good things and only focus on our differences. It is very sad to let politics, religion or a number of other labels cloud the good things we see in people.

I think what God is saying about being at peace with all is that we are to live in harmony with others, not allowing any oppressive thoughts or emotions to take control of our feelings toward them. In other words, we live in love. Just because someone does not interpret the bible the same way we do or go to the same church we do or does not go to church at all, we should realize that in regard to other believers, we are all wanting to love God and do what is pleasing to God. We are to accept one another in love and respect the fact that God is working in different ways in people. Just because it is not what we are used to does not mean it is not of God.

In regard to non-believers, we do not need to condemn them or force our beliefs on them. We are to let them see the love of God by the way we treat others. They do not need someone beating them down or twisting their arms to get them to believe like us. We are to love them as they are and let the Spirit do any work that needs to be done in their lives just as the Spirit does in our lives.

If we believers could understand that we are responsible for ourselves in the way we live for God. We are not responsible to live the way others do or the way others think we should. We are to allow the Spirit to work in our lives and follow the Spirit on the path we are on.

Our responsibility is to do what Jesus said, love God and love others. We are to accept them for who they are and pray that the Holy Spirit will teach us and guide us in the way we are to go. We are not responsible to force others to see things the way we see things. We are to love one another and accept one another as they are. Only by living in love can we live at peace with all.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

I write Posts often with two groups in mind. One group is those who have attended a church for years and either continue to go or have stop attended due to disagreements what God is really like.  The second group is those who are inclined to believe there is a God but have not been church-goers. The former group is more familiar with the pressure to know God’s will in your life. The latter group may wonder how do you know when God is directing you, when they hear others say “I had to do it because that’s what God told me to do.” 

Does God really control all that is going on? 

It is natural to think an all-knowing, powerful God has special insights into future outcomes. But to say God knows the future suggests a predetermined future which makes freedom nonsensical. God can’t know if your marriage will end up in divorce or your new job position will be discontinued in the future. God joins us relationally in a free, unknown future. God’s plan can’t be a detailed blueprint but a general one to set us free to love. God hopes as we do that our actions make a positive difference in the world. One can rightly question if God supposedly knows the future, why does God hide it from me? What parent does that if suffering could be avoided?

God may not speak to us demonstratively out of love

Just because earthly parents sometime know and advise what is best for their older child, such advice doesn’t always work out. In fact, overzealousness on the parent’s part can lead to a child feeling controlled, thus rejecting what is best for one’s own good. God’s awing or overwhelming presence may only lead to fearful obligations to obey. The road traveled of learning, reflecting, and not being pressured may best lead to lasting convictions and more meaningful relationships.  

What is God telling us to do? 

I know for a fact a loving God is telling me to love others like I want to be loved. That isn’t always clear what action to take, but neither can it be for God unless God has predetermined the future. Many decisions are obvious wrong – murder, abuse, adultery, etc. God doesn’t have to speak. Many decisions though aren’t black and white, even for God. Do we speak up about one’s behavior or risk driving them further away? God joins us in considering risks to change the world for better. God feels the disappointment we do when things don’t work out for the best. 

Influences in our life don’t have to be audible or certain. My parents aren’t alive, but I still sense their influence. God can’t tell us either that our decisions will work out. God deals with a free world also. God is hoping with us that our decisions will make for a better world. Don’t we sense God’s influence when we have thoughts to be the perfect partner, parent, or friend we desire to be deep down. God isn’t as hidden as we might think. God gives us the freedom to make decisions, and I understand the consequences of immoral decisions. God is in our uncertain life with us.

How Do You Know What God Is Telling You To Do?

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

 

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by Jim Gordon

Unfortunately, we know many people have been treated wrong within the church system. Some more severe that others, but none of it is good.

I think one of the groups that seem to be affected most by this are those who are LGBTQ. I have seen this group of people treated rudely and like second class citizens in many churches where they should find love and acceptance more than anywhere else. God said to love our neighbors, he did not say to love only those with whom we agree.

Even in the churches that are actually welcoming, LGBTQ people are often not accepted and allowed to participate fully within the organization or hold certain positions. They are welcome to come in and sit and listen so hopefully the church can change them, but they are not welcome to come in and participate in any way within the church program.

Christian people will deny rights and services to LGBTQ people based on their Christian beliefs, unfortunately even including fellow Christians who are LGBTQ. Even government office holders can refuse certain services and basically get away with it because they say it goes against their Christian morals. As a Christian, I say these things should not be. This is nothing like the example of Jesus.

Labels are placed on many people, gay/straight, black/white, male/female, christian/atheist, American/foreign/immigrant. Yet behind those labels are human beings who were created in the image of God. They are loved and accepted by God and we are told as followers of Christ to be known for our love for one another.

I feel for those who are LGBTQ. It hurts to see people who were created and loved by God be rejected and abused by those who claim Christianity. I think it is time to look past the labels, look past personal feelings and accept people just the way they are, because they are created and loved by God.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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by Jim Gordon

There are hundreds of various denominations within the Christian faith and thousands of various interpretations and doctrines based on the Bible. We seem to hear a lot about two of these groups, evangelicals and progressives, and they appear to be on the opposite ends of the Christian belief spectrum. Should we really make the differences out to be an us versus them way of life? My biblical reply is, my brothers and sisters, this should not be.

I grew up as an evangelical and spent nearly fifty years living with that belief. After many years of questioning my beliefs and what I was taught over the years, I became less evangelical and more progressive in my thinking. That does not mean I have suddenly become anti-evangelical nor am I an enemy to my brothers and sisters who follow the traditional evangelical way, I just do not go along with that way of thinking any longer.

Unfortunately, many times we get an us versus them attitude and fight and argue amongst ourselves over doctrine and interpretation of scriptures. Again I say, brothers and sisters, these things ought not to be. We are not enemies. We are not to be against each other. We are brothers and sisters in Christ with two different views of interpretation. As a verse in the Bible puts it, just as our bodies have many parts and each part has a special function, so it is with Christ’s body. We are many parts of one body and we all belong to each other.

We are to be a people that make up the one true Church which has many members, each with an equally important part to play and with Jesus as the head over all of us. This Church is not a building made with hands, but is each one of us who follows the example of Jesus. Just because we interpret scripture differently, just because we have a different view on what the Bible says does not mean we are enemies.

Rather than fight and argue over who is right or who is wrong, remember we are in this together as a family of God. We are one community of believers who want to serve our God by showing love to a hurting world. There are many ways of following the example of Jesus and living for God.

There are many people out there who are hurting, questioning and lost who do not know that God loves them. All they see are people who claim to know God who are fighting amongst themselves and who are condemning those who are different. Because of this they figure what is the use, there is no reason to become a part of this group of people. They are no different than anyone else.

Yet we who are followers of Christ are to show the world that God loves them. We are to do this by loving one another, encouraging one another and lifting one another up. We are to show the love of God to those who are hurting and who do not know that God loves them. We are to let the love of the Spirit of Christ flow from within us to touch others.

Rather than fight and argue amongst ourselves over doctrine, denominations and interpretations, we are to allow the Holy Spirit to guide us, teach us and love all people with the love of God. Remember that Jesus told us to love God and love one another. He never said to judge, condemn, discriminate nor exclude anyone.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

Spoiler alert! No beliefs are required to engage with God unless you are the Devil! It seems to me if God is real, God can work with individuals in their own journey. Hang in there with me since many readers have heard otherwise according to the Bible. How long a leash does God give? As long as it takes or God isn’t very patient, and a worse parent than I am with my kids.

What you don’t have to believe! 

It is claimed God condemns gays though who would intentionally choose a lifestyle that invites condemnation and discrimination. We are told God doesn’t want women fulfilling supposed “manly” roles though that only leads to favoritism and abuse. We are told God is a hellish, sadistic torturer according to beliefs while here on earth, but even humans wouldn’t create Hell for their worse enemies. Many claim to be so certain about God according to the Bible, but biblical scholars who have a deep respect for Scriptures don’t agree what the Bible says about gays, women, and hell, and other moral issues. See here.  See here.  See here.  We don’t need a Book to know murder, sexual abuse, stealing, lying, etc. are wrong.

Don’t I have to forgive my abuser? 

Forgiveness of others is often the central theme of the Christian faith. Many are turned away from God because claimed God requires we forgive our abuser, despite their refusal to admit any wrongdoing. For some forgiving despite lack of remorse can control bitterness. For others to forgive despite lack of remorse can cause feelings of further victimization and bitterness. Those hurt must seek the mind of God what actions in relationships are in your best interest in a world full of tragedies. You may discover God is empathetic! The Bible is not a rules book for every situation. The Bible says don’t lie, but should we lie if protecting Jews from Nazi extinction? Restitution may not be possible despite forgiveness. Be weary when the guilty start making the rules and demand to just move on.  See here.

Surely God requires eventually the sinner’s prayer?

The sinner’s prayer to avoid Hell isn’t in the Bible. When Jesus interacted with a woman caught in adultery, He first stopped the crowd’s stoning attempts. Then, Jesus simply told the woman “go now, and leave your life of sin” (John 8). Pretty good advice. Didn’t Jesus have a better evangelical spiel in case He never saw the woman again? Jesus seemed on a difference mission according to the Bible than simply avoiding Hell.  See here.

Don’t I have to believe Jesus was God in person and resurrected? 

I am not sure if Jesus was God in human form or God’s representative here on earth. Jesus did seem to have a lot in common what seems true about a loving God. Many may have stopped reading. It gets worse.  I am convinced Jesus’ resurrection isn’t legend and has solid historical verification, but others may not. Jesus told followers He was coming back from the dead and they didn’t believe Him despite witnessing Jesus’ miracles beforehand. They only believed after seeing Jesus resurrected with their own eyes. I would like to think more of us if we witness a man or woman coming back from the grave, after killed on a cross, would be convinced. You may have to believe in the possibility of a God to begin a faith journey, but don’t let doubts you have prevent taking steps toward God.  

How can we really know what God is like and expects? 

Some would argue the Bible tells us what God is like. But the challenge is we don’t all agree on interpretation when it comes to knowing what God is like. I don’t know one person, whether a church-goer or not, that doesn’t think any God worth believing in must be a perfect, loving God. The parent-child relationship comes to my mind when imaging how a Creator might love their creations. A parent’s perfect love is the same as God’s love. God’s love surely is other-directed not self-consumed. I only wish for my child to consider the possibility that my love only wants to help them in their journey of becoming the person deep down they want to become. We just want a chance to influence for good. Are we better lovers than God?

Can the institutional church be saved? 

Many of us stopped going to “church” for good reason. The reason so many denominations exist in the Christian religion is they can’t all unite and agree on the essentials. I am skeptical of the church changing because of the lack of discussion of differences. The church is no better than our politics. Attempts are made to silence differing opinions rather than encouraging a discussion of differences that may lead to a greater good for all involved. Try it in marriage!

How can we proceed without required beliefs? 

Billions in the past have believed in the possibility of a Creator. They couldn’t all be lunatics. Do you want to be more “in” with God? I am not sure there is anything to lose in beginning a journey of faith if the desire is to live life with fewer regrets. Personally, the biggest reason for being a God-follower is the inspiration and encouragement I sense in striving to be a better human being. Give God’s influence in your life a chance if so inclined. The good news is regardless of your belief – we are all still accountable to the same moral actions. Such actions are determined by discussion and striving to love others like you want to be loved.

What Beliefs Are Required To Gain God’s Favor?

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

Is your experience similar to mine? I enjoy talking about God for spiritual health reasons without any hidden agenda to convert others, but I begin blogging years ago about God because few want to discuss what role God plays in their life. Church can be one place to discuss God, but many of us discovered our contrarian questions weren’t always welcomed in such a setting so we moved on. We discuss family and work relationships. Why not our relationship with God?

Differences of opinions can be uncomfortable

Spiritual topics, like politics, can be touchy. There are diverse opinions in the spiritual arena which might lead to avoiding potential conflict. Groupthink is just human nature. Most humans desire to integrate with a group, get along with its members, and benefit from them. Discussing opposing beliefs can be uncomfortable and can lead to questioning our own beliefs thus creating anxiety.

Christians tend to have an “agenda” reputation

Conversations with God followers often feels like them trying to change your beliefs. We all hate when our partner doesn’t listen and just wants to give advice. I hate to admit I use to have an agenda with those outside the institutional church. I was taught God’s good news was saving people from Hell so they could get into Heaven. I was wrong according to Jesus. See here.   The ship may have sailed others trusting us to have open conversations. All I know to do is to focus on a life where actions speak louder than words in case others want to pursue convos about God.

Claims made about God stifle conversations 

Many of us are into God but many of us left the institutional church because claims about God’s character was contrary to our deepest moral intuitions. Why believe in a God you can’t respect. It is only intuitive that a Creator loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. Beliefs about God’s love that don’t match how you know you ought to love your neighbor may be amiss. Don’t believe everything you hear about God! See here.

Some don’t want to give up stuff or change

Spiritual folks are too quick to assume people don’t discuss God to avoid self-reflection. I suppose many may believe there is a God but don’t pursue because it may require changing some habits, but I doubt that is a main reason for most people. If you know what you are doing is harming others and you don’t care, that is on you. But if struggling with habits that you know are hurting you and others, God doesn’t have a list for you to conquer before getting to know God. Conversation can be stifled when we make assumptions about others and why they may not believe in God.

Believing what we can’t prove is normal 

Faith in God isn’t much different than faith in a lot of life. We still get on an airplane or sit in a chair, not because we know but have reason to believe it is safe. No religion can be proven beyond some doubt, but that doesn’t make faith unreasonable. Maybe we can’t reconcile why God doesn’t intervene more with evil and suffering in the world. Lack of certainty doesn’t mean there aren’t plausible reasons how a loving God can exist in such a world. If you have an inclination there is a Creator, consider initiating such conversations. Many God-folks enjoy such conversations.

Why Is It So Awkward To Talk About God With Others?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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by Jim Gordon

I see a common problem among those of us who follow Christ these days. We talk about Jesus as a person from the past and seem to learn about him only from books, pastors and the so-called spiritually educated. We actually know it in our head, but usually do not act on the fact that Jesus is alive and his Spirit lives within each of us as his followers. We have a living relationship and daily fellowship with him through his Spirit.

The bible says that he gives us his Spirit and we do not need anyone to teach us. The Spirit will guide us into all truth. We need to let that get deep down within us and quit looking to only books and people to tell us what they think about Jesus and ask the Holy Spirit to teach us and lead us into his truth.

We Christians get so caught up on which pastor, evangelist or Christian leader to follow. We listen to this one or that one, read books from this guy or listen to tapes by that woman. We attend a fellowship because we like the pastor, or we will drive miles to listen to a popular TV or radio evangelist.

We also need to remember that the Spirit has already been given to us and we do not have to run to this meeting or that church for the Holy Spirit to fall upon us. The Spirit already lives within us.

God says we are all brothers and sisters in Christ, and we are all fellow-servants. We are not to be called leaders in an authoritative way, no one is higher up than anyone else. Leadership is done in love, servanthood and from experience in our walk with God. Those who have been walking with God longer can encourage those who are newer in their walk.

We can learn and be encouraged by reading the bible with the guidance of the Spirit. We can learn and be encouraged through fellowship with our brothers and sisters in Christ. Yet we seem to forget the most important truth which is the Spirit is within us. We are the temple of the Holy Spirit (1 Corinthians 6:19). We have the mind of Christ (1 Corinthians 2:16).

In Christ we are all his children, no one should be looked up to or revered more than anyone else. We should stop putting all our hope in other people and learn to listen to the Holy Spirit who is within us to teach us truth and guide us in the way we are to go.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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