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Archive for January, 2025

By Mike Edwards

Morality isn’t determined or depend on one’s Holy Book

Christians often claim that determining morality must have a source such as the Bible or then only based on subjective feelings. What about before the Bible existed or those that don’t revere the Bible – are they clueless about morality? Morality can’t be whatever an individual feels or there could be no laws such as murder, or a murderer could claim they felt their actions moral. I will discuss first why one’s Holy Book cannot be the definitive source for determining morality from immorality. I will conclude how then can we go about determining what is moral, though we can’t always claim certainty such as if capital punishment is the more moral stance.

We can’t prove the Bible is divinely inspired by God

Christians leaders often argue that the entire Bible is divinely inspired by God. Since they believe God is perfectly moral, the Bible then is their basis for morality. It must be claimed the Bible is entirely divinely inspired, or humans can only guess what passages are inspired. The biggest proof often given to suggest God inspired perfect morality written down is because the Bible makes such claims (i.e. 2 Tim 2:16). But a Book isn’t proven to be inspired because it claims to be inspired. Those who claim God inspired the Bible don’t accept the Koran to be divinely inspired if claimed.

Even if the Bible is inspired by God, our interpretation aren’t divinely inspired 

Even if we could prove the writers of the Bible always understood God perfectly, our interpretations may not be inspired. Biblical scholars who have a deep respect for Scriptures don’t agree what God thinks about many moral issues such as hell, gays, or women’ roles. Gays are often condemned, women’s leadership roles are limited despite their gifts, and it is suggested a fiery torturous afterlife awaits infidels – all in God’s name. Extremists often will advocate killing infidels in this life because their Holy Book is inspired by God and their interpretation is right.

Why don’t we want to use the Bible as the determinate of morality?

A supposed divinely inspired Bible, without admitting one’s interpretation could be wrong, causes many relational atrocities. The Bible in the past has been used to defend slavery. It is claimed God condemn gays. Many may be unaware biblical scholars who respect the Bible don’t believe Scriptures condemn gay monogamous relationships. See here. Many parents feel obligated to condemn their gay children in the name of God. I am begging Christian leaders to stop condemning gays because the Bible supposedly does. Admit you could be wrong. Stop with nonsense “hate the sin, love the person.” You don’t know being gay is a sin. Besides, it is impossible to feel loved and accepted when such words are used. Why would anyone choose to be gay based on the condemnation and bigotry they face?

Churches today still deny women using their spiritual gifts by preventing them from serving in the church. The Bible could easily be interpreted to suggest God suggests roles based on gifts not gender. See here. Maybe even worse, submission is often interpreted in marriage to imply when there is an impasse, someone (guess who) must make the final decision. I have never had a marriage issue in 42 years that can’t be solved creatively together. Men in authority over women can encourage dominance on the man’s part, which can be conducive for domestic abuse and the other atrocities women face at the hands of men. Women need men with the heart of a servant!! (Eph. 5:28-29) If we at least stopped claiming certainty in God’s name regarding gays or women’ roles, according to the Bible, it would reveal more the loving God we believe in.

How do we determine what is truly moral? 

Over half the world born into this world didn’t have a Bible. Were they morally clueless?

Most who believe the Bible is divinely inspired though not admitting interpretation challenges, would suggest a Creator has endowed his creations to know good from evil. We can intuitively know how our Creator loves – the same way we were created/born to love one another. We don’t have perfect knowledge but most understand the question we ought to ask ourselves and others – am I loving others perfectly? Or am I loving others like I want to be loved. This intuition is why rational human beings believe murder and sexual or physical abuse is immoral, unless you believe an assumed divinely inspired Holy Book advocates such actions.

Only extremists deny there is objective truth except for their claim “there is no objective truth.”

Morality is rooted in human nature, rather than just a product of religious influences. Biblical interpretations that go against our moral intuitions may be wrong. Why would God create you to intuitively feel different. Moral and immoral decisions begin with discussing what is common, often universal, moral sense. This applies to religious decisions, legal decisions when making laws, or even political issues such as immigration or climate change. We don’t always know what perfect love is, but we should be all asking together – “What leads to the greater good?”

How Do We Determine What Is Moral? No, It isn’t According To the Bible!

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

12 Reasons To Believe Hell Is A Myth!

What Is God’s Plan For Your Life?

Why Do People Leave The Church Building But Not God?

Why Do Many Deconstruct Or Deconvert From God?

Are Biblical Stories Helpful Or Harmful To Children?

God Is Exactly Like Who You Think!

9 Reasos To Not Trust The Bible’s Claims About God!

Why Don’t We Want To Call Ourselves A Christian Nation (Christian Nationalism)?

Can And Does God Control Your Suffering?

Did You Know The Bible Says Nothing About Marriage?

Did A Miracle Save Trump?

How Do You Decide What God Is Really Like?

Who Should We Vote For?

Is The Bible Really The Word Of God?

Who Goes To Heaven?

How Do You Not Turn A Child Away From God?

What Are Harmful Lies About God?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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by Michael Donahoe

Do you notice how we Christians get so caught up on which pastor, evangelist or leader becomes our focal point? We listen to this one or that one, read books from this guy, or listen to tapes by that woman. We attend a fellowship because we like the pastor, or we will drive miles to listen to a popular TV or radio evangelist. But wait a minute, doesn’t God’s word say that the Holy Spirit will teach and guide us? Aren’t we all brothers and sisters in Christ, all fellow-servants? We are not to be called leaders, no one is higher up than anyone else (Matthew 23:10 – Do not be called leaders; for One is your Leader, that is, Christ). We do not need anyone to teach us because we have the Spirit of Christ within us, the true living Word lives in each of us. In Christ, we are all His children, no one should be looked up to or revered more than anyone else. True, we can learn from one another by the way Christ works in each of our lives, but we should stop putting our hope in other people and start listening to the Holy Spirit that is within us for truth and guidance.

For many, it is hard accepting the fact that God lives within us. Sadly, the church rarely teaches or emphasizes this fact. We have been taught that if we listen to the pastor, read the Bible and live our lives trying to follow the commandments, one day we will go to heaven and live with God face to face. We have an image of God sitting on a throne way up in heaven and here we are, far, far away down on earth. Yet, Jesus said the Spirit lives within us, and the Kingdom of God is within us. We do not have to wait until some day in the future, we are living in the Kingdom right now.

Rather than spending time to focus on the inner voice, the inner intuition, we talk about going to a meeting and the Spirit showing up, or being at a specific place because God is there. We pray and talk with God, yet we wonder if our prayers are even being heard. The more I read, I am finding that we really have the whole thing backwards. God does not show up anywhere because God lives in us.

The Old Covenant has been fulfilled in Christ and we are now living under a New Covenant. We no longer have to try to be good enough. The law was a tutor that led us to Christ, but now that Christ has come, we no longer need a tutor. We are free from the law! The Spirit of God now lives within us.

Jesus came to live among us and show us the love of God. When Jesus left, he said he would send us the Spirit. Notice he did not say he would send us a pastor or a book. God has now come to live within us through the Spirit. Jesus said the Kingdom of God is within you. We are the temple of the Holy Spirit and we have the mind of Christ. Jesus prayed that we would be one with God just as he and God are one.

Sounds to me that we are missing the main point. We do not have to wait to die to go to heaven and enjoy kingdom living. We do not have to wait to be united with God. We no longer need to look to a human guide, teacher or preacher. We have the living, powerful, perfect Word of God living inside us who is our teacher and guide.

There is nothing wrong with listening to others, getting their thoughts and ideas and being encouraged by other believers, but we do not need to rely on other humans. We have the Spirit within us, teaching us and guiding us in the way we should go.

We do not have to look up in the sky to some far-away place and wonder if God is listening. We do not have to go to church to hear what the pastor has to say. We can turn our thoughts inward and realize the Spirit is right there within us, listening, loving us and ready to teach us as we begin to hear his voice from within.

We are all at different stages along the path we walk with God. We need to remember none of us have it all figured out. We so often want to fight and argue from the understanding we currently have without realizing that we have not reached completion. The Spirit did not stop teaching us when the Bible was completed. There is more the Spirit wants to teach us as we become ready to listen and accept it.

We should come to accept each other where we are currently, realizing what we know and believe today will more likely be different a little further down the road. We can love each other, learn from one another and accept each other as we are, just like Jesus loves and accepts us just as we are. Yet, our main goal is to look deep within ourselves, listening for the voice and guidance of the Spirit. We should not put our hope in others and those we think are more spiritual because they have been trained, educated or paid to do so. Remember, we are all kings and priests and have the same Spirit within us. Each of us are equal and important parts of the body with Christ as the head. His Church is not a building, not a denomination but it is the people.

This is not saying we are God, but the Spirit lives within us and we are one with God. It would do us all good to start focusing on this fact rather than thinking of a future event after we die. Kingdom living is now. Listening to the Spirit, being taught by the Spirit and living day by day in communion with God is a reality that we all need to live in each and every day.

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Michael Donahoe was added as a writer as his views fit perfectly with those of Done with Religion. He also writes on Substack at https://personalmeanderings.substack.com/

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By Mike Edwards

I wrote recently here  what might be the greatest misunderstanding about God and getting saved. Christians often emphasize the main message about God and the Bible is avoiding hell and getting to heaven by saying the sinner’s prayer: “God, forgive me for my sins and thank you for dying on the Cross to pay the price for my wrongdoing.” No such prayer is found in the Bible. Recently, I failed to include the greatest objection below to what I am claiming – that the Apostle Paul, who wrote a lot of the New Testament, supposedly spoke of something similar to the sinner’s prayer. It is important because we may be misrepresenting God’s main message to us.

The main message can’t be about avoiding Hell 

I bet if you ask most non-church people what church people say is important about the Christian faith, they will talk about getting saved to go to heaven to avoid hell. The main message can’t be about Hell which doesn’t literally exist. See 12 Reasons To Believe Hell Is A Myth! There is no word in Hebrew or Greek for “hell,” only possibly words used as metaphors to illustrate that spiritual death is as tragic as physical death. The Apostle Paul who wrote most of the NT never refers to Hell. No prophet in the OT warned of Hell as a consequence for behaviors here on earth.

What did Jesus say about eternal life? 

Jesus never spoke of something similar to the sinner’s prayer to make others feel secure about the afterlife. True, he couldn’t talk about the purpose of the Cross since hadn’t happen, but Jesus message seem to be more about the here and now, not trying to terrify you about the afterlife. When Jesus was asked how to have eternal life, Jesus didn’t speak about a physical destiny but life here on earth. (Lk.10:25-37) Jesus simply answered the question “love God and your neighbor,” speaking more about the quality than quantity of life. Jesus elsewhere defined eternal life as beginning in the here and now (Jn 17:3), not what awaited in the afterlife.

When Jesus met his disciples, he only said “follow me.” (Mark 1: 16:17, 2:14) A set of beliefs wasn’t required. The main message to the disciples was living a life worth living. When asked what was the greatest commandments, Jesus only said to love God and your neighbors (Mark 12:30-31). What! Not drop to your knees, pray, and ask for forgiveness! Jesus encouraged loving God because Jesus knew that leads to loving others.  The above interactions are like when Jesus dealt with the women caught in adultery. (Jn. 7:53-8:11) Jesus only encouraged the woman to go and sin no more. He might never see her again. Where was Jesus evangelical spiel?

Didn’t Paul though preach repent to avoid punishment?

It is argued that Paul did say “believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” (Rm 10:9) Paul recognized Jesus’ death and resurrection, but Jesus’ sacrifice was to draw attention to the Good News already proclaimed by Paul – God’s desire to empower unselfish living. Paul preached about the Kingdom of God being here (Acts). Paul did say “the wages of sin is death.” (Rm. 6:23) But Paul is speaking of spiritual death because Paul is still alive though sin has put him to death. (Rm. 7:11) Paul mentions Heaven twice in Romans, yet says nothing about Jesus dying so we can go to Heaven (Rm. 1:18, 10:6).

God wasn’t so pissed to require Jesus’ death than yours

To insist God required Jesus be murdered on the Cross in place of you isn’t Godly or parental love. Google “theological views of Jesus’ death” for many interpretations about Jesus’ death. Did Jesus and the Romans have no choice but to murder Jesus for an unjust cause? Soldiers die for one another because of a cause they believe in. Jesus thought his message was worth dying for. Jesus accepting death than powering over others may be the reason billions have been influenced to live unselfishly. Jesus wanted to change our attitude about God, not to change God’s attitude toward us. What kind of God sees how the world has turned out and doesn’t just say the Hell with it, but instead enters such a world to experience underserved suffering via the Cross to inspire and relate? 

What really is God’s salvation?

Jesus spoke of a life, worth living, empowered by God, for your good and those you have relationships with. I believe Jesus spoke of loving God not to get into heaven but to receive help in loving others as deep down you wish you could. I get help from God in pursuing a life with less regrets, of being the husband, father, friend, and man I truly want to be. It’s on God to come through for you if you choose to follow. Jesus when leaving this earth spoke of having God’s spirit within us. God’s influence, though invisible, can be the same as a parent who has left this earth that you believed loved you to the fullest. The Bible/Jesus/God’s message isn’t dropping to your knees to avoid Hell to go to Heaven after death, but start loving now with God’s help – a path toward great relationships.  

Getting Saved Isn’t About Going To Heaven Or Hell!

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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By Mike Edwards

I wrote recently 13 Lies according to one’s understanding of the Bible that I believe do the most harm to God’s reputation, thus turning many away from God. The problem isn’t the Bible but one’s view of the Bible. When one believes God inspired/approved all written about God in the Bible, they assume the biblical writers always portrayed God accurately. Furthermore, many go a step further and assume their interpretation is the right one, but ancient literature is always subject to interpretation.

Unbelievers, women, and gays

There is no doubt the following lies have impacted millions if not billions over history – that God created a forever, torturous hell for beliefs held for a brief time while living on earth, that God is bias thinking women can’t serve in religious or marriages roles that men can, that God condemns gays for an attraction choice they no more control than do straights. Many have rejected God based on claims made about hell, women, or gays. See 13 Lies

What may be the most harmful lie about God according to the Bible? 

It is often claimed and assumed that God’s main message according to the Bible is that salvation is about going to Heaven or Hell rather than how to live life here on earth. The main message can’t be about Hell which doesn’t literally exist. There is no word in Hebrew or Greek for “hell,” only possibly words used as metaphors to illustrate that spiritual death is as tragic as physical death. Even when Jesus was asked how to have eternal life, Jesus didn’t speak about a physical destiny but life here on earth. (Lk.10:25-37) Jesus simply answered the question “love God and your neighbor,” speaking more about the quality than quantity of life. God cares more about you here and now, not trying to terrify you about the afterlife if you don’t believe.

God is so pissed to require your death isn’t the main message about the Cross

To insist God required Jesus be murdered on the Cross in place of you isn’t Godly or parental love. Google “theological views of Jesus’ death” for many interpretations about Jesus’ death. Did Jesus and the Romans have no choice but to murder Jesus for an unjust cause? Soldiers die for one another because of a cause they believe in. Jesus thought his message was worth dying for. Jesus accepting death than powering over others may be the reason billions have been influenced to live unselfishly. Jesus wanted to change our attitude about God, not to change God’s attitude toward us. What kind of God sees how the world has turned out and doesn’t just say the Hell with it, but instead enters such a world to experience underserved suffering via the Cross to inspire and relate? 

What really is God’s salvation?

Jesus spoke of a life, worth living, empowered by God, for your good and those you have relationships with. I believe Jesus spoke of loving God not to get into heaven but to receive help in loving others as you wish you could deep down. I get help from God in pursuing a life with less regrets, of being the husband, father, friend, and man I truly want to be. It’s on God to come through for you if you choose to follow. Jesus when leaving this earth spoke of having God’s spirit within us. God’s influence, though invisible, can be the same as a parent who has left this earth that you believed loved you to the fullest.

What One Lie About God May Be the Most Harmful?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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