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Posts Tagged ‘acceptance’

Why Might People Reject Or Not Believe In God?

Posted in Bible, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , on September 15, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

I don’t have any polls or mass audiences to rely on to answer this question definitely. I am convinced it is important we speculate, because how we answer this question can impact how we view and talk to others about God.  It is important for God-followers to understand there are many, many reasons why someone either rejects God or hesitate to believe in a God in the first place.

What do many Christians claim about those who reject God?

The first chapter of Romans in the Bible is used to suggest all who don’t believe in God are suppressing what they know to be true. But it seems the biblical writer assumed his audience believed in God but ignored God to justify their evil ways. Let’s not accuse those who believe in a God as needing a crutch or accuse those, who question the reality of an invisible God, as being wicked and ignorant of their feelings. If wrong to doubt God exists, Christians sin if doubt God in tough times. We all have friends who don’t share our belief in God, but they are just as moral.

People reject God for good reason because of claims made about God 

Many claim that God tortures those forever in the afterlife if reject God here on earth, that God rejects women in leadership roles, and God condemn others for being attracted to the same gender. If I believed that, I may reject God also. Who can blame others for rejecting a God contrary to our moral intuitions! One’s view of God is often based on one’s interpretation of the Bible or belief that the biblical writers understood God perfectly. We can’t prove the biblical writers were always right about God, but even if the writers had perfect understanding the Bible is subject to interpretation. The truth is biblical scholars who have a deep respect for Scriptures don’t agree what the Bible says about gays, women, hell, and other moral issues. See here.  See here.  See here.

Many rightly reject God for personal reasons

A child sexually abuse by their father may struggle to accept a God betrayed as our Father in Heaven. Does God really judge them? Some are open or desperately want to believe in God but can’t get their head around why a loving God doesn’t intervene more with so much evil in the world. Does God really judge them? Why would a gay person believe in a God who supposedly condemns them for sexual attractions they no more choose than straights. The truth is many aren’t rebellious but question why God is the way God-believers claim God to be like!

There are reasonable objections to not believe in God

Some rightly can’t understand what a good God – the only God worth believing in – doesn’t intervene more in this world with evil. I have suggested a possible explanation here as espoused by biblical scholar Thomas Oord. It makes the most sense to me, but it may not satisfy you or others. People that don’t accept apologetic reasons given for God and evil are not being rebellious.

Also, why is God so hidden for those who truly want to believe in God. Many may reject God because God doesn’t reveal themselves more. This isn’t rebellion; they want to believe. Let’s condemn those who say “I don’t care if there is a God. I will treat others however the hell I want to.”

How do we treat those that do or don’t believe in God?

There are many reasons why one might believe in God or not. Let’s listen to their personal journey without judging them. Personally, believing in the possibility of a God hasn’t led to perfection but has offered a moral guide in my relationships. But I know friends who are agnostic and put to shame some Christians’ treatment of others. I have a close relationship with God perhaps due to being raised in a home that focused on God. Then again, others in my situation may go a different direction because of the difficult relationship I had with my parents. Trust me – I’m no moral giant! Scholars don’t agree the Bible definitely says those who don’t believe in God in this life will be rejected by God in the afterlife. I am convinced a loving God will have a personal conversation with all in the afterlife whether to continue in the afterlife together. I suppose character pursued in this life may influence one changing their mind.   

Why Might People Reject Or Not Believe In God?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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Who Should We Vote For?

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , , , on September 1, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

I try to keep my Posts for the most part spiritual in nature as opposed to political. But those two arenas share commonalities. Both suppress freedom of speech or at least open dialogue. Try claiming God doesn’t condemn gays. You are called a heretic in many religious places. Dare to argue Covid vaccine benefits versus risks and you are called a misinformer or conspiracist. It seems to me freedom of speech is critical. May the pursuit of truth win! 

Should we vote on a candidate based on sexual history?

Currently, there are two candidates running for President in November 2024. You may need to google several search engines about their possible past sexual behaviors. If guilty, they simply join a list of past Presidents. Isn’t it more important current behaviors than past transgressions they may regret? We don’t know if they regret their sexual past because no one ask, and our past sins aren’t necessarily best to be made public. Ask their partners. And since none of us were there in the bedroom in the past, we may never know the full truth. So, basing one’s vote on past sexual behaviors is tricky. We may find no one qualifies.

Should we vote based on one character’s – if a racist, Jew hater, etc.?

Both candidates are accused of being anti-democratic. Often, candidates are accused of being a racist. In past decades racists didn’t hide their hatred for those not their color. It was obvious. I admit I am tired of being accused a racist because I am a white dude. I married my daughter to a black man with my blessings and I have biracial grandchildren. Crazy but I love them as much as the white grandchildren. I never agreed with my parents that whites can’t share the same water fountains as blacks. Yes, I am old. I am not sure we can ever definitely determine one character behind closed doors or what is claimed by others. If candidates openly proclaimed they hate Jews (i.e. Nazis) – I don’t vote! 

Vote on what you feel best for your country, children, and grandchildren

The joke is all politicians lie. Look for one who lies less. If you lean left make sure you read from those who lean to the right. I think it is fair to say the majority of mainstream media outlets lean left so the search is more challenging. If you lean right, make sure you understand policies and viewpoints of those on the left. I would suggest it’s not about one’s personality, unknown private affairs, but policies for our future.

Best decisions (finances, etc.) are made not just with our feelings but our cognitions too! Who has the best economic policies that help those who live paycheck to paycheck, not those who can survive inflation because fortunate to have extra monies? Who has the best border policies that protect us from letting in those who wish to harm us with drugs or who are on terrorist lists, etc.? Who has the best crime policies that protect us from evil people while pushing for equal justice for all?  Who best advocates for free speech so the best ideas can win the truth debate? You decide!

Who Should We Vote For?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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Why Might Religious Leaders Hold To Questionable Beliefs?

Posted in Acceptance, Bible, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , , on August 11, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

Are you willing to admit you may be wrong in your view of God. We can all agree God hates sexual abuse. I have no doubt that God doesn’t condemn gays, even according to the Bible, but I am open to discussion if you are. Disputable beliefs have different consequences for the layperson as opposed to leaders. Livelihoods can be at stake for religious leaders if they don’t preach certain beliefs according to the expectation of denominations or people in the pews. 

One’s view of the Bible is a problem

It is assumed God approved everything written about God in the Bible. The problem is God isn’t always portrayed as loving. See here.  Even if the writers understood God perfectly, which we can’t prove, we can’t claim our interpretations are perfect. Biblical scholars who have a deep respect for Scriptures don’t interpret/agree what the Bible says about God’s views about gays, women, hell, and other moral issues. A Creator surely loves the ways their creations ought to love one another. Perfect Godly and human love must be the same. A supposed inspired Book must not replace our discussion of common moral sense given to us by our Creator.

People loving certainty is a problem

Laypeople often find comfort psychologically in certainty rather than uncertainty. One may believe the seemingly certain narrative because unknowing can create anxiety. Also, disagreeing with friends or those in leadership about God’s character can lead to conflict and loneliness due to isolation. It doesn’t matter if those who proclaim certainty have good intentions or believe their ideas are right about God. Openness is critical in case we are wrong.

Not claiming certainty can have great consequences for those in leadership positions. It is not easy changing your mind in front of people you have advised to believe something different. Laypeople often crave certainty, so less than dogmatism can lead to anxiety for the flock. Threats of job security for leadership is real if disagreeing with the popular but uncertain narrative. In politics different opinions might not lead to reelection. Pastors risk being kicked out of the pulpit.

So, are we clueless what God is like? 

A Book cannot be the sole determinate of what God is like since the same passages are subject to different interpretations. Our inborn sense of good and evil, not an ancient Book, tells us sexual abuse or murder is immoral. A Creator surely loves the way creatures intuitively think they ought to love. We all seem to know the question we ought to ask ourselves – am I loving others perfectly? There will be less disagreements when we don’t insist on our interpretation of a Book. People deep down know how to handle disagreements. Until we all ask ourselves “am I acting toward others like I want to be treated,” we are destined to fail and come to a solution. 

Christian leaders must recognize their hypocrisy!

I am sure I don’t always know my own hypocrisy, but I recognize hypocrisy when I see it! Many conservative Christians leaders accuse the current government Administration and health officials of misleading by maintaining their interpretation is scientific truth. It’s hard to understand the scientific truth keeping bars open but not churches during the pandemic. It used to be not science if there wasn’t debate. Well, it isn’t biblical truth because you say it is according to your interpretation. It is true science is fluent. It is also true we can’t prove God exist much less that our view of what God is like is correct. ‘Uncertainty” falls both ways – religion and science. 

Freedom of expression because of uncertainty is critical to lead forward 

Freedom of ideas are what separate democratic societies from dictatorships. Freedom is often quashed because individuals claim certainty in their beliefs. Christians leaders condemn gays in God’s name because the Bible says so, and demands others believe as they do. They don’t consider they may be wrong. See here.  Climate experts don’t agree with the narrative concerning climate change. Claiming certainty rather than defending one’s position is not how a democracy works. One must have the freedom to make their own decisions when there is uncertainty. Religion and science are playing God (Superior) in the lives of others by claiming they know the truth and we are too stupid to decide for ourselves!

What is a religious leader to do?

When universal agreement doesn’t exist, such as the evil of sexual abuse, it must become obvious that one must be allowed to form their own opinions since uncertainty exists. We must stop being so damn certain of our understanding of God according to the Bible, especially when our interpretations are contrary to our moral intuitions. The central message about God in the Bible seems to be to strive to love others like you want to be loved. I will debate anyone who thinks a loving God, by Jesus’ example, encourages treating others like shit. We can stop labeling those who disagree with our biblical interpretations as heretics. We can stop calling those who disagree with our views of science as conspiracists. Thousands of denominations exist because of the focus on uncertain beliefs. I am convinced the only belief God cares about is loving others as you best know how!

Why Might Religious Leaders Hold To Questionable Beliefs?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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What May Be The Main Reason We Can’t Agree To Disagree?

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Community, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , , on August 4, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

I written here many fears we may face in sharing certain beliefs with others. I am probably being too simplistic suggesting a main reason why we don’t discuss our differences whether it be about God or politics, but I am looking how to begin a discussion. I know many don’t venture certain discussions because of the consequences. Pastors loss their job if certain opinions about God are contrary to what their congregation believes. We have seen medical doctors’ licenses threaten with not agreeing with the Covid vaccine narrative. But I am desperate to understand why we avoid important conversations. Don’t we get closer to the truth sharing our opinions with one another?

We avoid pain by staying away from certain conversation

For one to question a main belief they have been taught in church all their life, such as if Hell is real, can create doubts about other beliefs they have been taught.  Questioning if the Covid shots are safe in the long-run, if we have gotten the shots, can raise anxiety about our health. Perceived certainty rather than uncertainty is more comforting psychologically. Unknowing can create confusion or anxiety. Anxiety is avoided by not discussing one’s beliefs with others who believe differently. I imagine also many avoid certain discussions because they don’t feel able to defend their position or they prefer to avoid possible conflict generally.

I have written here how assuming certainty during uncertainty can be a relationship destroyer. Certainty is an illusion unless talking about universal moral sins such as rape or incest. Adultery isn’t only wrong in the eyes of the betrayer. Most decisions are not black and white and require open debate by those in authority. Assume uncertainty if you have one rational friend who believes differently from you whether it’s about religion or politics.

Civil discussions are critical in the pursuit of truth 

Obviously, we may also avoid disagreements because such discussions can get heated. We must control our emotions when discussing our beliefs. We must talk to others like we want to be talked to. We must stop labelling others. We often are quick to consider or call others heretics or conspiracists when differing in religion or politics. How about thinking one has a different opinion than resorting to name calling!  

How can we begin having civil discussions?

  • We must stop thinking our views are morally superior to those we disagree with unless speaking of universal accepted moral truths
  • We must handle differences with physical and emotional civility, accepting that misinformation isn’t opinions that don’t agree with our own
  • We can begin conversations by looking for areas we agree
  • We can defend our reasoning, respect the opinions of others, and commit to pursuit of truth

What about those who refuse to agree to disagree?

Do Christians or God-folks always look the other way or forgive uncivility – not treating others like they want to be treated? I don’t have to accept those who demand a literal Hell is biblical at the expense of unbelievers in their journey here on earth. See here.  If one insists Hamas raping women and burning babies alive is justifiable because of perceived past disputes, I will condemn you. Jesus didn’t forgive the Pharisees before condemning their ridiculous religious laws. Open-mindedness doesn’t mean there aren’t common, universal, moral beliefs. Wisdom is required!

What May Be The Main Reason We Can’t Agree To Disagree?

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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What Is The Greatest Destroyer Of A Nation?

Posted in Bible, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , , , , on June 16, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

Countries ruled by Dictators where there is no personal choice have failed miserably. Human nature cries out for freedom and to not be led like sheep. Democratic nations or those who have some assemblance of freedom are fortunate if able to fight for their rights. Politics, religion, and science/health practices have something in common that is dividing our country and families. We easily recognize this destroyer in our family/personal relationships but not in public arenas.

Certainty leads to close-mindedness and refusal to discuss differences 

If you find one rational person that has a difference of opinion from your own, you cannot be certain of your opinion. I don’t care if it concerns the safety of vaccines, climate solutions, or if God condemns gays. There are rational or rights to opinions on both sides. Couples who claim certainty are headed toward divorce or a sucky relationship. God-followers and religious leaders seem hell-bent in telling people what they must believe about God according to their understanding and interpretation of the Bible. Politicians who refuse debate of their policies are no different. You can spot destructiveness or evil a mile away – those who censor other opinions. Leaders play God (Superior) in the lives of others by claiming to know the truth and we can’t decide for ourselves.

Why can’t we be more openminded? 

Certainty rather than uncertainty is more comforting psychologically. One may believe what seems to be the popular narrative because unknowing can create confusion or anxiety. Anxiety is avoided by not discussing one’s beliefs with others who believe differently. For one to question a main belief they have been taught in church all their life, such as if Hell is real, can cause one to question other beliefs they have been taught. Questioning if the Covid shots are safe in the long-run, if we have gotten the shots, can raise anxiety about our health. What if we pushed others to get the shots and we end up wrong? Trusting authority always can sometimes be misguided.

The most benign explanation for denying freedom of choice is one who believes they are doing the best for all concerned. This denies uncertainty. The more evil explanation for censoring the opinions of others is one’s desire for control which leads to power over others, intentional or not. Control and power often lead to security (jobs). Control and power flourish when others are not allowed to discuss alternative opinions in the public arena. It isn’t science or theology if there isn’t debate. That is why we often change our mind when able to participate in discussions. One way to judge one’s motive is to question why they fear debating others if they are so sure they are right.

How can we know what is true 

Certainty is an illusion unless talking about universal moral sins such as rape or incest. Adultery isn’t only wrong in the eyes of the betrayer. Most decisions are not black and white and require open debate by those in authority. One must have the freedom to decide what is the best decision for themselves, or the powerful rule the powerless. Those fortunate enough to live in a democratic society must accept the vote of the majority when comes to law setting. You can still defend your position in hopes of a future vote. May the best, most common-sense position win.

I am convinced all know how a loving human should act, whether they never had a Bible (majority born in this world) or don’t believe in God. Christians leaders often claim we must be guided by biblical principles. They assume their interpretation is correct. It is common to hear one argue “The Bible says” without adding “according to my understanding.” The truth is contrary biblical interpretations exist for many moral issues. Hell, we can’t be sure if there is a literal Hell according to the Bible.  See here.

What is God so hidden?

Religious people may ask why God doesn’t make truth more obvious. God may not speak to us demonstratively out of love. Just because earthly parents sometime know and advise what is best for their older child, such advice doesn’t always work out. In fact, overzealousness can lead to feeling controlled, thus rejecting what is best for one’s own good. God’s awing or overwhelming presence may only lead to fearful obligations to obey. The road traveled of learning, reflecting, and not being pressured may best lead to lasting convictions and more meaningful relationships. Maybe God speaks to us in non-dramatic ways (influence) out of love!

The path forward to save a Nation

  • We must first stop claiming our views are morally superior to those we disagree with unless speaking of universal accepted moral truths
  • We must handle differences with physical and emotional civility
  • We must begin conversations by looking for areas we agree
  • We must discuss differences by defending our reasoning, respecting the opinions of others, and commit to growing in understanding
  • We must be openminded. Consider why you are afraid to defend your belief if you supposedly know the “truth”
  • We must protect one’s freedom to choose when the possibility exists we could be wrong
  • We must stop censoring or labeling others as heretics or conspiracists that we disagree with
  • We must stop supporting politicians who advocate censorship or label those who disagree with them as mis-informers. Why believe their view if they can’t defend their views for the supposed good of the world?
  • We must use language that conveys respecting one’s right to believe in a Creator or not

What Is The Greatest Destroyer Of A Nation?

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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Should Christians Try To Convince Others About God?

Posted in Acceptance, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , on May 19, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

I experience God being such an encourager in helping me to be more the person I desire to be deep down. If you are inclined to believe in God and you don’t feel God’s encouragement, it may be your views of God. See here. Christians often feel an obligation to share God with others because being taught God’s message was believe or go to Hell. Was that how Jesus interacted with others?

How did Jesus interact with others?

Many, including me, are convinced to understand Jesus is to understand God. Jesus encouraged his twelve disciples simply to follow Him. They didn’t all believe right away until Jesus proved himself. Jesus told the woman who had committed adultery: “go now, and leave your life of sin” (John 8). Where was Jesus’ evangelical spiel to avoid Hell? Jesus was asked by a religious expert how to have eternal life. He simply said to love God and your neighbor (Lk.10:25-37). I have a hunch Jesus thought loving God would lead to loving others. Jesus’ example and message wasn’t about escaping Hell but avoiding the destructive consequences of sin in this life. God can help in such a journey.   

How has God acted in convincing others? 

I suspect God is a respecter of one choosing their beliefs. Evil in the world clearly reveals God doesn’t force compliance, or there wouldn’t be so much horrific evil in this world. God obviously understands what we humans know – freedom is necessary for authenticity. Not even God can force true love. If you are thinking God eventually “gets you” in the afterlife by sending unbelievers to Hell, I doubt it.  See here.  

Christians must avoid the “agenda” reputation

Conversations with God-followers often feels like them trying to change your beliefs. We all hate when our partner doesn’t listen and just wants to give advice. One reason many avoid spiritual discussions is because they can smell a hidden agenda a mile away. It’s wrong to engage in friendships with others for the purpose of converting them to believe as you do, without advising upfront your agenda. Christians must avoid the appearance of having a hidden agenda. Conversations need to be natural and mutual.

How can Christians represent or share God?

God may not speak to us demonstratively out of love. Just because earthly parents sometime know and advise what is best for their older child, such advice doesn’t always work out. In fact, overzealousness can lead to a child feeling controlled, thus rejecting what is best for one’s own good. We must be considerate in our discussions about God with others. The road traveled of learning, reflecting, and not being pressured can lead to lasting convictions and more meaningful human and spiritual relationships. We don’t have to feel guilty because we aren’t convincing others about God and their love for them. Most Christians believe God has influential power. God believers can relax and simply share their personal experience if an opportunity naturally arises!

Should Christians Try To Convince Others About God?

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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How Do We Pursue “Truth” That Will Heal A Nation?

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Jesus follower, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , , , , , , , on April 28, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

Claiming Truth falsely can be destructive. Many Christian leader claim that we as a people and nation must rely on biblical truth. Can we always know what biblical truth is? Attempts have been made to censor mis-informers in the public arena. Can we always know what misinformation is concerning science or political policies? We must be careful what we claim as Truth and how we interact with others during uncertainty.

What is scientific or biblical truth? 

The bedrock of science use to be considering hypotheses to explain a phenomenon in the natural world. It is an educated guess based on the information we have currently have and could change if we get new information in the future. Drugs are often approved initially, only to be pulled from the shelves later after causing death. The truth is that it isn’t science if there isn’t debate!

Ancient literature subject to interpretation cannot be the definitive word on truth. Besides, even if all agreed that the Bible correctly interpreted confirms God condemns gays or forbids women in leadership in religious institutes, we cannot prove that the writers always portrayed God accurately. Any biblical truth claimed must also agree with natural truth such as sexual abuse is evil; otherwise, we must purse truth with an open mind.

Are there self-evident truths we can agree on?

No, one can’t just follow their own heart! What reasonable or rational person doesn’t expect the golden rule from others in their own relationships. Our inborn sense of good and evil, not an ancient Book, tells us sexual abuse or murder is immoral. Most criminals don’t defend their murders or thefts; instead, they deny committing such crimes. We don’t debate many laws, only what is a just punishment. It is a dictatorship not a democracy when we impose our will on issues such as pandemic responses, taxes, climate change, immigration, etc. Dictatorships don’t end well. Benefits and risks exist for most issues.

Freedom of speech is critical 

Denying free expression of belief is playing Superior in the lives of others. God is the example for God-believers. God has respected freedom of beliefs from the very beginning; otherwise, God who is powerful enough to create would annihilate immediately those who oppose God by choosing evil. Freedom is necessary for authenticity, the highest good in relationships, or we could accuse God of not creating the “best” world. A true debate of differing opinions, regardless if you think one is a heretic or conspiracist, is our best chance at arriving at the most caring decision for all concerned. Until we all ask ourselves “am I acting toward others like I want to be treated,” we are destined to fail. That doesn’t mean we shouldn’t confront those who reject freedom of speech! 

Uncertainty can be a good thing 

Certainty rather than uncertainty comforts individuals psychologically. One may believe the seemingly certain narrative because unknowing can create anxiety. When only one side is presented, control and power grow intentionally or unintentionally. It should be intuitive denying diverse opinions is unloving and controlling. Couples who act as if they are always right and their partner is wrong are headed toward divorce. Having good intentions by believing you are right for the whole doesn’t matter when certainty isn’t universal. God-followers and religious leaders seem hell-bent in telling people what they must believe about God according to their understanding and interpretation of the Bible. Politicians seem hell-bent in claiming certainty regarding policies such as climate change and immigration, though there are arguments on both sides. 

Should we avoid those who claim certainty and don’t pursue truth civilly?

One has every right to question when one claims certainty regarding non-self-evident truths. Even evil people don’t think others can violate their rights in ways that they violate others. A refusal to openly discuss or defend one’s views suggest an unhealthy dependency on “certainty.” If someone makes false claims of those who oppose them such as calling them racists, without being able to give specific examples, are they really interested in pursuing truth? How about “they have a different opinion!”

What are necessary paths to pursing truth? 

There are truths which almost has universal agreement. Do you know one person who denies adultery is wrong except the betrayer?

  • Shouldn’t Christian leaders quit always claiming their biblical interpretation is correct and at least acknowledge literature requires interpretation “according to their understanding?”
  • Shouldn’t we examine all Books about religion to discern what seems the most universally true? What are Christians afraid of if they have the truth?
  • Shouldn’t we listen to everyone’s opinion and seek to discern together what is the most loving action according to the circumstances?
  • Shouldn’t we first stop claiming our views are morally superior to those we disagree with unless speaking of universal accepted moral truths
  • Shouldn’t we can begin conversations by looking for areas we agree?
  • Shouldn’t we discuss differences by defending our reasoning, respecting the opinions of others, and commit to growing in understanding
  • Shouldn’t we stop labeling those who disagree with our biblical interpretations as heretics?
  • Shouldn’t we can stop calling those who disagree with our views of science as conspiracists?

Open-minded uncertainty, rather than supposed certainty, could go a long way to healing our nation and personal relationships. Imagine how different as a people we would be if religious and political folks had open discussions what are the most caring actions for the greater good concerning non-universal matters such as immigration or climate policies. Most religions agree the overriding moral guide is to love others like you want to be treated. Belief or lack of belief in God doesn’t give you an excuse to not treat others like you want to be treated.

How Do We Pursue Truth That Will Heal A Nation?

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Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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So Many Divisions within the church

Posted in Acceptance, christian living, institutional church, Jesus follower, religion, The church, tagged , , , , , , , , on April 3, 2024|

by Jim Gordon

It is sad that Christianity is divided into so many different groups. We all have a little different interpretation of the Bible and a little different understanding of doctrine. Obviously, we are not going to agree on everything, but we certainly should be able to love one another and accept each other even when we differ on these things.

It is hard to understand why there are so many divisions when God tells us we are to be one, as Jesus and God are one. Yet, we understand that we are human and it is easy to lose sight of our first love. If we could only stay focused on Christ, listening for his voice and the guidance of the Spirit, loving God and loving others as God intended, then we could begin to look past our differences.

The problem seems to be that we are unwilling to see any other viewpoint other than our own. There are those such as my wife and I that do not attend an organized church. There are those who attend a church every time the doors are open. Some attend a house church, some meet with fellow believers at cafe’s, parks or restaurants, and others meet in their homes over dinner. We should accept these differences and love one another rather than argue over who is right and who is wrong.

There really is not a right or wrong way to assemble together and we need to stop expecting everyone to do things exactly the same way. We should respect the viewpoints of others and focus on loving them rather than expecting them to see things our way.

Things will not change until we start focusing on what is common in our lives rather than the differences. The common focus should be on Christ, the head of the body. After that, we should focus on loving others rather than arguing about the differences in interpretation.

We should also keep in mind that we are all constantly changing as God brings new truth to us. We are all learning and changing as we are ready to accept new truths. The interpretations I had five years ago are completely different from some of the interpretations I have now. I am sure in another five years they will change again as God leads me into more truth.

Sometimes we are afraid to accept the opinions and interpretations of those who are outside of our belief system because we feel if we do not hold to our way of thinking, we are compromising and not standing up for what we believe. We do not have to give up how we interpret the Bible, but neither should we think everyone else is wrong. Besides, we really are not responsible for leading others into our truth, or convicting them of sin, or even saving them. That is the job of the Holy Spirit. We are told to love God and love others.

When we realize we are each equally important functioning parts of the body, and Christ is the head, we can start to change how we feel about those who do not see things exactly the way we do. We can begin to accept our brothers and sisters in Christ as they are, as we realize we are walking as one with the purpose of sharing the love of God.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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We Are Called to Love

Posted in Acceptance of Others, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , on March 21, 2024|

by Jim Gordon

Jesus told us in the New Covenant to love God with all our heart, soul, strength and mind, and to love others as ourselves. So why is there so much disagreement and arguing over matters that none of us really have any control over?

Even Christians cannot seem to get along. There are so many different denominations and groups, all because we cannot agree on our doctrines and interpretations of the Bible.

I think we are all, Christians and non-Christians alike, people of some kind of faith. We all have faith in something. The thing is, we fight and argue over our faith and beliefs, yet none of us can prove our faith one way or another.

We get mad at each other because we have different views. We separate ourselves and think less of each other, yet we cannot prove what we believe. We will condemn and convict others, yet there is always the chance that what we believe may be wrong.

Why is it that we cannot just accept one another. We can have our beliefs, interpretations and ideas yet not force them on others. We should not expect everyone to believe just like we do. We are constantly learning as light is shed on new truths over time as we are ready for them.

Rather than fight and argue over what we believe and try to force our beliefs on others, why can’t we love one another just like God asked? Why can’t we just love God and others and accept them for who they are, where they are and leave the rest to God.

Rather than look at people of this world according to what they believe, and who or what they have faith in, I think to be more like Jesus we should be loving and accepting of them just the way they are. This is not to say everyone can live the way they want without consequences. It is not to say everyone will come to God in their own way, that all roads lead to God. Christ came for the purpose of restoring fellowship between people and God. It is by grace, provided by Christ, that we come to God.

Reading about the life of Christ, we see a man who loved people. A man who accepted people for who they were. He did not condemn them nor did he separate himself from those who were different. Jesus loved them. To be Christ-like in our world today, I think we should do the same.

No matter what we believe, what our faith is in, what interpretation we have, none of us can prove a thing. None of us has any control over it. It is all in God’s hands. So why spend so much time fighting and arguing. Let’s allow the love of Christ to flow out of us to touch a world that is so desperate for true love and acceptance. Let’s remember that everyone is entitled to their opinion and view on faith. Whether we all agree on God or not, we can agree to treat one another with kindness, respect and in a loving way.

Jim Gordon and his wife left the institutional church after spending over fifty years within the system. Jim wanted a way to express his thoughts and concerns about the religious system and why he and his wife decided to leave the institution but not their faith in God. Jim can be contacted by email at: jimgordon731@gmail.com

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9 Reasons To Not Trust The Bible’s Claims About God!

Posted in Acceptance, Bible, christian living, Love of God, tagged , , , , , , on March 17, 2024|

By Mike Edwards

You may not notice some of the vilest claims in the Bible about God until you begin reading very closely. Leaders tout that God inspired/approved all written in the Bible, yet some actions contributed to God by the writers make no moral sense. Unfortunately, newcomers will be directed to read the Bible and be horrified reading about some of God’s supposed actions. Rationalizations are given to explain such actions about God to protect God’s inspiration of the Bible (writers understood God perfectly). I suggest instead considering if biblical writers always understood God correctly. Do the following passages really describe a loving God? There are hundreds. I will conclude by suggesting how to read the Bible without being revolted. 

Contradictions in the Bible

Contradictions are one reason to doubt God’s inspiration/oversight of the Bible. If God can raise the dead, God can obviously control transmissions of words supposedly given to the biblical writers – but God didn’t! The list of contradictions may be trivial but are sizable (See Gregory Boyd, Inspired Imperfection, Chapter 1):

  • II Sam 24:1 says God incited David to sin; I Chr 21:1 blames it on Satan
  • 2 Kgs 24:6 says Jehoiakim had a son; Jer 36:30 says Jehoiakim didn’t have a son to reign after him
  • Does God take pleasure in destroying (Deut. 28:63), or does God take no pleasure in the death of the wicked (Ezek. 33:11)?
  • Does God punish children for the sins of parents (Ex. 34:7; Num. 14:18), or does God never punish children for what parents do (Ezek. 18:20)?
  • Matthew says Jeremiah rather than Zechariah spoke about the thirty pieces of silver (Mt 27:9-10. Zech 11:12-13)
  • Did Jesus say the rooster would crow once after Peter’s three denials (Mt 26.34, Lk 22:34, John 13:38), or did the rooster crow twice (Mk 14:30)

Moral challenges concerning God’s character are much more disconcerting. I will cite only a few below that advocate violence or immoral actions in God’s name.

God supposedly kills an entire human race by drowning

“Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; human beings and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark.” (Gen 7:23)

Keep in mind Genesis talks about a magical tree of good and evil and talking snakes. A Global Flood could be a literary device to illustrate the destructiveness of human versus God’s ways. Maybe the writers used an analogy of a Flood and drowning because their world view including God controlling the natural world. I might not read the Flood story to young children but wait to explain that God didn’t really drown practically the entire human race. Personally, I wouldn’t use a drowning analogy to portray God’s character. Not sure God would either!

God supposedly mandated death for cursing, gathering sticks, etc.

When it comes to many of the laws, the OT claims God spoke these words (Exodus 20:1). Biblical writers rarely claimed audible God-speak. “God said” recorded hundreds of times in the Bible is most likely a figure of speech expressing inner impressions or understandings about God – right or wrong. How can we be sure the writers heard inner God’s voice correctly?

  • Did God really mandate whoever curses their parents be put to death (Ex. 21:17)?
  • Did God really mandate to death a man gathering sticks on the Sabbath (Num 15:32-36)?
  • Did God really require death for adultery (Lev 20:10)? That’s a lot of bodies today
  • Did God really command whoever does work on the Sabbath be put to death (Ex 31:15)?
  • Did God really command death for those who blaspheme the name of the Lord (Lev 24:16)?

God supposedly approved a wife’s hand being cut off when grabbing a man’s genitals

“If two men are fighting and the wife….reaches out and seizes him by his private parts, you shall cut off her hand. Show her no pity.” (Deut 25:11-12) 

A woman raped is forced to marry her rapist

“If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered…..He must marry the young women, for he has violated her.” (Deut 22:28-29)

Women were seen as property of the father or husband and she was no longer valuable (being a virgin) after being raped! Did God really approve a woman being required to marry her rapist as if this was a step up to protecting victims from a life of shun? 

God supposedly orders killing boys and non-virgins but sparing virgins for the warriors 

“Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.” (Num 31:17-18) 

Did God really stay silent because the Israelites couldn’t handle the truth that requiring a woman to marry soldiers who killed their children and husband is evil? Sounds like men writers imagining God talking to them! 

God supposedly commanded genocide – all men, women, children, infants, and animals

“This is why the Lord Almighty says….Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy all that belongs to them. Do not spare them: put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.” (I Sam 15:2-3) 

“Twelve thousand men and women fell that day – all the people of Ai. For Joshua did not draw back the hand that held out his javelin until he had destroyed all who lived in Ai. But Israel did carry off for themselves the livestock and plunder of this city, as the Lord had instructed Joshua.” (Joshua 8:25-27). See also Joshua 10:28.

If you don’t think this is morally repulsive, how would you react if you read these same commands in the Koran? 

A daughter is given as a reward for being victorious in Battle 

And Caleb said “I will give my daughter Aksah in marriage to the man who attacks and captures Kiriath Sepher.” (Josh 15:16)

Just in verse 13 the Lord was supposedly giving commands to Caleb. It is reasonable to think the writer assumed approval by God giving the daughter away. Why didn’t the writer at least mention God’s outcry to stop treating women as possessions and property. That is wrong regardless of culture norms as were civil right violations in America decades ago. I bet God was speaking up, but men in biblical times just weren’t listening as many Americans too in the past.

God will slay with thirst, have sex in public to shame, and then speak to her tenderly 

See Hosea 2: 1-14. I imagine this story was to illustrate Israel’s unfaithfulness to God, rather than God literally telling Hosea to marry a promiscuous woman. I doubt though God wanted to be portrayed slaying with thirst (v. 2), possibly have sex in public to shame her (v.10), and then act as if God can then start talking tenderly (v.14). I can think of better illustrations to portray a loving God. I got a hunch the writers were portraying how they perceived God.

God supposedly is arbitrary with justice

God kills Uzzah for putting his hand out to balance the Ark from falling (II Sam 6:7), yet God is silent when David committed adultery and had Bathsheba’s husband killed. (2 Sam 11:14) Even in the New Testament God supposedly struck dead Ananias and Sapphira for lying how much money they donated to the church (Acts 5). Then, God is said to kill some for celebrating Communion without examining their heart. (I Cor.11:30). I would be dead!

How can we know God if not through the Bible 

Despite contradictions and moral challenges, many hold on to an inspired Bible for fear the Bible will be discarded for “whatever goes” in understanding God. A Book subject to interpretation cannot be the definitive word of what God is truly like. Biblical scholars interpret differently the same passages, and most of us don’t acknowledge our interpretation could be wrong. The challenge is many interpret their inspired Book as God being violent or advocating violence. This has led to imitating or justifying violence in the name of a perfect loving God.

Few believe God dictated the writers’ recordings. You certainly can’t prove God controlled the writers’ thoughts to always understand God perfectly. As mentioned “God said” is recorded hundreds of times in the Bible. This is likely a figure of speech expressing inner impressions or understandings about God written down – right or wrong. We can’t prove the writers understood God perfectly other than taking their word by claiming they are inspired by God (2 Tim 3:16-17). That is circular reasoning. We were surely created to love the way the Creator loves. It isn’t presumptuous to imagine what a loving God is like though our moral consciences. See here.

Why should I bother to read the Bible?   

The Bible is God’s story beginning with Israel and culminating with the life of Jesus that we don’t possess in other documents. God may have inspired/encouraged the writers to write but didn’t necessarily approve of everything written about God. When reading the Bible, contemplate what a loving God is really like. Enjoy what God is trying to reveal to you about your Creator and how to treat others. Imagine if extremists had to consider that God didn’t inspire every word in their Book and had to openly discuss what a loving God is like. Interpretations about God’s love toward others, that don’t match how you and most know you ought to love your neighbor, may be amiss. A Book must not replace our relationship with God and common moral sense. Questioning the Bible may lead to knowing God better!

9 Reasons To Not Trust The Bible’s Claims About God!

MikeEdwardsprofilepic125

Mike Edwards has been writing for Done with Religion for some time and has been a great addition to the site. He couldn’t find enough people to discuss God openly so he started blogging years ago. Mike also has his own site where he writes that can be found at What God May Really Be Like  He can be contacted by email at: medwar2@gmail.com

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